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ANDERSON COOPER 360 DEGREES
Ohio Kidnapping Survivor Confronts Captor
Aired August 1, 2013 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Erin, thanks very much.
Good evening, everyone.
Tonight, the frankly unbelievable words from a man who says he's not a monster and the proud, brave words from one of the three women to whom he was precisely that, a captor, a torturer, a rapist, a killer, in short a monster.
Amanda Berry, Gina DeJesus and Michelle Knight endured all of that year after year held captive by Ariel Castro in his torture chamber Cleveland, Ohio, home. They were victimized but they're not victims. Amanda, Gina and Michelle are survivors.
Calling them a monster's victims we think gives far too much credit to the monster. He needs to be forgiven. Preferably sooner rather than later. But there is plenty of time for that. He got a life sentence today plus a thousand years. That's what a judge gave him after hearing powerful testimony from Michelle Knight and a truly delusional account from Mr. Castro himself.
Now it's very rare to see someone who may be a true psychopath justify their crimes. Today in court on live television, we saw just that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ARIEL CASTRO, CONVICTED KIDNAPPER AND RAPIST: Most of the sex that went on in the house, and probably all of it, was consensual. This, this -- these allegations about being forceful on them, that is totally wrong. Because there was times they would even ask me for sex. Many times. We had a lot of harmony going on in that home.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: A lot of harmony going on in that home. That's what he said.
In the hour ahead, we're going to look closer at whatever inside someone's mind makes them say things like that with Dr. Drew Pinsky and others who spent a lot of time with what the survivors went through, how they stayed sane and what recovery now looks like.
First, Pamela Brown with today's sentencing hearing.
MICHELLE KNIGHT, KIDNAPPING SURVIVOR: From this moment on, I will not let you define me or affect who I am.
PAMELA BROWN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A resolute Michelle Knight confronted her former tormenter head on for the first time since escaping captivity.
KNIGHT: You took 11 years of my life away, and I have got it back. I spent 11 years in hell. Now your hell is just beginning. I will overcome all this that happened but you will face hell for eternity.
BROWN: When it was Ariel Castro's turn in a rambling and bizarre speech, he refused to take responsibility for what he did but at one point he did attempt to apologize.
CASTRO: I am truly sorry to the DeJesus family, Michelle and Amanda. You guys know all the harmony that went on in that home. I ask God to forgive me.
BROWN: Castro also denied physically and sexually abusing the women.
CASTRO: Most of the sex that went on in the house, probably all of it, was consensual. This -- these allegations about being forceful on them, that is totally wrong.
BROWN: He even tried to justify his behavior.
CASTRO: These people are trying to paint me as a monster, and I'm not a monster. I'm sick. I've been, I've been -- my sexual problems have been so bad on my mind that I'm impulsive.
BROWN: But the evidence shows a very different story. Over defense objections prosecutors presented a detailed reconstruction of what the women endured for a decade inside Castro's home using a model of his house and showing these photos of their disheveled rooms with boarded up windows and rusty chains.
They even described how the girls were abducted, including the moment when he lured his first victim, Michelle Knight, inside his house.
DET. ANDREW HARASIMCHUK, CLEVELAND POLICE, SEX CRIMES UNIT: He takes her down to the basement where she's physically retrained with a chain, plastic ties are put on her wrists, and a motorcycle helmet that is placed on her head. At this time she is sexual assaulted.
BROWN: To her joy on the day she was finally rescued.
OFFICER BARBARA JOHNSON, CLEVELAND POLICE: She literally launched herself into the officer's arms. He -- legs, arms, just choking him, and she just kept repeating, you saved us, you saved us.
BROWN: Family members spoke for Amanda Berry and Gina DeJesus. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She is strong beautiful inside and out and is doing better every day. To Ariel Castro, may God have mercy on your soul. Gracias, and thank you.
BROWN: In the end the women relied on each other for survival and are drawing on the same strength that helped them survive so many years in captivity.
KNIGHT: Gina was my teammate, my friendship with her is the only thing that was good out of this situation. We said we will some day make it out alive and we did.
COOPER: Pamela Brown joins us now from Cleveland. What struck you the most in the court today. Because watching this, I just found it -- don't think I've ever seen anything like this, hearing this man who -- we're going to hear more from experts ahead, but I mean, his -- I mean, he seems to be a psychopath that he actually believes these things that he was saying.
BROWN: Yes, he seems delusional. It was jaw-dropping, Anderson. I've been covering this story from the very beginning. I was in the courtroom with Ariel Castro at the very beginning and at that time he had his head down. He wouldn't say anything to the judge, wouldn't make eye contact with anyone. He just looked really ashamed.
And then today, it was like he was a different person. It was a stark contrast to how he was before. He was looking around, leaning back in his chair, even interrupting the judge, and of course, we heard his bizarre rambling speech. So there really seemed like there were two sides of him.
But, Anderson, there were some poignant moments today that struck me. It was very powerful obviously to see Michelle Knight's steely resolved. She might be small and stature, around 4 feet tall, but she clearly has an indomitable spirit.
You know, if you would ask me who I thought would have testified today, I wouldn't necessarily have said Michelle Knight in the beginning. Of course she endured the worst abuse. She had the toughest recovery, but yet today, she walked up there and faced her tormentor head on. And not only that, Anderson, but she stayed there at the sentencing through the end of it.
The family representatives for the other two victims left the courtroom, but Michelle Knight stayed there as Ariel Castro attempted to apologize and justify his behavior. So it was incredible to see that. And even the judge pointed out her remarkable courage and in her soft spoken voice, she said, you're welcome. It was a lighthearted moment in what was a very emotionally charged day -- Anderson.
COOPER: Yes, I mean, you can't attempt to apologize in one breath and then the next breathe justify your behavior, and say that this was consensual sex. Pamela, appreciate the reporting.
Joining us now is senior legal analyst and former federal prosecutor Jeffrey Toobin, criminal defense attorney Mark Geragos, former FBI profiler Mary Ellen O'Toole, and Dr. Drew Pinsky, host of HLN's "DR. DREW ON CALL."
Mary Ellen O'Toole, did he act today like you would have expected from someone like him, someone whose done the things that he's done? Because I just want to play for our viewers something else that he said about these women and how they got into his vehicle. Let's play that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CASTRO: She got into my vehicle without even knowing who I was. I don't blame, I'm not putting fault at her but I'm am saying, I'm trying to make up a point across that I am not a violent predator that you're trying to make me look a monster. I'm not a monster.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: I mean, he is blaming the victims here, the survivors here.
MARY ELLEN O'TOOLE, FORMER FBI PROFILER: He's absolutely blaming the three survivors. He's taking no responsibility for his behavior, and that's very classic psychopathy. We were -- all of us witnessing, in my opinion, a classic psychopath today and the hallmark is that --
COOPER: You have no doubt about that, that he's a psychopath and that's what we saw today?
O'TOOLE: That's what we saw. He's not out of touch with reality. He knows right from wrong. The rules don't apply for him and the hallmark again is this inability to empathize or feel guilt. It was all about him today. All about him.
COOPER: And Mary Ellen, the forensic psychiatrist that the prosecution brought in, you know him. Explain what he meant when he said that there is no mental illness here with Castro.
O'TOOLE: I do know Dr. (INAUDIBLE) and have worked with him for a number of years and he's wonderful. What he meant by that was there was no mental defect on this individual based on his opinion and that meant that there is no debilitating mental illness that caused him to act this way because he was delusional or psychotic.
He completely knew right from wrong and he engaged in these behaviors willingly. He knows the rules. They don't apply. So there was -- there's no mental defect. He was not out of touch with reality.
COOPER: So he's a psychopath you believe but he wasn't out of touch with reality? O'TOOLE: Psychopath is not a mental illness. Psychopath is a personality disorder, it's not a mental illness. We -- we sometimes confuse those two, but someone who is mentally ill may not understand the nature or the consequences of their actions. Not the case with Ariel Castro.
COOPER: Dr. Drew, what do you think?
DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST: I agree 100 percent what Mary Ellen is saying here and I -- it's -- we're seeing the human being really in its worst form. This is about as bad as humans can get. He is not only a monster. He is also sick. He may have also had sex addiction and people with sex addiction will distort their victims. In other words, I've seen sex addicts who literally tell me that a 4-year-old was coming on to them, what were they supposed to do?
COOPER: But the idea --
COOPER: But the idea of this guy blaming an addiction, I mean, when he said that, you know, I mean, I -- you just -- it's like what? Give me a break. I mean that his addiction to port that's led him to this?
PINSKY: Yes, it makes -- listen. Absolutely it's ridiculous. It's an explanation for some of the things you're trying to get your ahead around, is how could he say these things? But it is not a justification and it doesn't diminish what Mary Ellen was saying about this being a full-fledged psychopath.
COOPER: I want to play just what he said right there. Let's play this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CASTRO: I believe I am addicted to porn to the point that it really makes me impulsive and I just don't realize that what I'm doing is wrong. I know it's not an excuse. I'm not trying to make excuses here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: I mean, every time he said, I'm not trying to make excuses, you can just take out the "I'm not trying to" and just say I'm making excuses.
PINSKY: Yes, his point of view begs no alternative. Everything in his life, even if it is an illness is used to justify unjustifiable behavior. It really makes your -- when you listen to this guy your brain just goes out of guilt. Like, how can he possibly be this bad? I see the astonishment on your face, Anderson. And it is astonishing when you hear how a psychopath thinks and then you see what they have done to other people and don't seem to be able to understand that.
COOPER: Well, that -- I mean, that's why I do think it's important to -- you know, as harder as it was, important to actually listen and see this guy's face because it's rare to actually see a psychopath -- you know, you see them in movies and stuff and they're kind of -- you know, an actor kind of make -- this is apparently, it seems like a true psychopath and just the coldness of it, it was -- just stunning to watch. And you found it hard to watch.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: The focus of it reminded me a good deal of Jerry Sandusky, in a different way. That sort of self-obsession, self-pitying, narcissism. Sort of calm, almost flat effect.
My own reaction to this was bizarrely a line from "The Great Gatsby" where Nick Carraway says, conduct may be founded on the hard rock or the wet marshes but after a certain point, I don't care what it's founded on.
I mean, I just didn't where it was found.
PINSKY: Right. Yes.
TOOBIN: I just didn't care what his problems were.
TOOBIN: I didn't want to listen to him. And, you know, I guess it was a public service of some kind to broadcast it but --
COOPER: Mark Geragos --
TOOBIN: -- I found it unpleasant in the extreme.
COOPER: Mark, were you surprised that he was allowed to talk as long as he did in that courtroom?
MARK GERAGOS, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: No, I -- could I just weigh in here for my perspective which I --
GERAGOS: You know, I'm not an addiction specialist and I'm not going to quote "The Great Gatsby." But from my standpoint, this was a spectacle. And, you know, I've represented people who are as delusional or didn't have any understanding or any insight into what they were doing and they justify it because that's how the human mind works.
The human mind, it's very rare for somebody to kind of follow on the sword and have the kind of insight that you would need to not do this kind of thing. But that -- having -- that having been said, the idea that this thing was televised and that the prosecutors gave this guy this opportunity and then started to act, I thought, in a crazy manner banding about thousands of years, whether we're going to have a thousand years or 9,000 years or this, that or the other.
And you know, lay people who aren't in the court system take a look at this, and I think they get the most skewed version, and if anybody thinks that this in any way, shape, or form resembles what happens in a courtroom, except for, you know, the fact that you're processing people who are very, very sick, it's a caricature. And I think it's unfortunate.
TOOBIN: But Mark, I think --
GERAGOS: I think it's very unfortunate.
TOOBIN: I think there was a political problem the prosecutors were dealing with. There was tremendous desire to see the death penalty in this case. And the prosecutors had to persuade the public that they were not letting this guy -- letting this guy off easy.
I think they made the right decision. They saved the government a great deal of money. This will be resolved much cheaper, much faster. They saved the victims the experience from having to testify but they had to persuade the public that there was a lifetime sanction here. So they used the figure of a thousand years, obviously that is not meaningful. But that's --
GERAGOS: But don't you --
TOOBIN: But that -- I thought that --
GERAGOS: But don't you think, Jeff, that fits in -- don't you think that fits into what we've talked about before and how the death penalty machinery and how it has infected the criminal justice system? This is precisely what ends up happening.
TOOBIN: But this is a good thing.
GERAGOS: In order to try and put on -- no, if you didn't have the death penalty he would have gotten life without anyway. So what difference does it make? And why do you have to put this guy out there and broadcast this live for whatever period of time and have his meanderings kind of like the Unabomber, you know, manifesto being published, and then have prosecutors who may normally be rational talking about thousands of years and maybe he should get a thousand as a minimum.
COOPER: I don't think --
GERAGOS: But maybe he should get more. I just think the whole thing seems like a parade of lunacy.
COOPER: I found -- I mean, maybe just because I work in television I'm interested in people's stories and try to understand people, and Mary Ellen, I want to talk to you about this, but I do find it valuable to look into the face of a psychopath and try to --
COOPER: And to actually identify and say you know what? There are psychopaths among them -- among us, this is what it looks like. I know, Mary Ellen, there is one part of Castro's speech that sent a chill up your spine. I want to play that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CASTRO: If you seen the YouTube video of Amanda this weekend, that right there itself proves that that girl did not go through no torture. That woman did not go through torture. Because if that was true, do you think she would be out there partying already or having fun? I don't think so.
I seen Gina, and in the media, she looks normal. She acts normal. She's happy. The victims are happy. I haven't seen much of Michelle.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: I mean, I could not believe this guy is saying these things.
O'TOOLE: And that's -- if you can imagine, that's what we hear during an interview and that's what I think the detective was talking about today when he talked about how he set up an interview. You have to be non-judgmental and be prepared for this onslaught of information and you cannot sit there and say no, I can't believe you're telling me this, because you want them to talk.
You want them to tell you what happened. Even though you're head is spinning like in the exorcist. It is stunning. It is shocking, but this is what a psychopathic sexually sadistic predator is like.
COOPER: And, Dr. Drew, the fact that he's sitting in prison watching YouTube videos of the women that he abused for years and years and years. How is that possible?
PINSKY: It makes -- I don't know what the prison allows but I do know it makes your head spin to think about this guy and his behavior. It's just unbelievable.
But I think, Mark, humbly I disagree with you. I think they have done a public service by taking a good, hard look at this guy. These people tend to be manipulative, charming. They are in many of our lives. If you -- you cannot believe what many people say and if you see any evidence that someone is behaving inappropriately you must act no matter what they say and really be suspicious.
A lot of people rely on our country, a lot of people have sociopaths and psychopathic tendencies and you're looking quite squarely in the face of it tonight. There it is. That's how they think. They don't understand emotions. They only act as if they had emotions because they have none.
COOPER: And I -- you know, I think that's a good point, Dr. Drew, because you put that guy in a suit, and he could be -- look, I mean, he could a college professor.
COOPER: He could be anybody that you run across at any point of the day.
PINSKY: Look, he told you. He's got a job. It's fine. I'm a good guy. I got a job. I function in society therefore I'm fine. Let's get on going here. There are a lot of people like that in this country.
PINSKY: Mark, sorry, but there are. And by the way --
TOOBIN: In the survivors' statement --
GERAGOS: Drew, Drew, don't apologize, Drew, but I'm going to tell you, there's a lot of people who like to watch Jerry Springer's daytime show, too, and I just think that it does, to a certain degree, a real disservice to the criminal justice system to give him the forum to do this and kind of lionize him in a perverse way. I mean, that's what ends up happening.
TOOBIN: I was just saying there was a moment in her statement where she said you would go to church every Sunday and then come back and do this. Imagine going to church every Sunday while these three women and one child were chained, literally chained to the wall in his apartment -- house.
COOPER: Incredible. Dr. Drew, appreciate you being on. Mary Ellen O'Toole, Mark Geragos, Jeff Toobin, thanks very much.
Let us know what you think, follow me on Twitter, @andersoncooper.
Next, what the three survivors are going through now and the years of healing ahead of them. Elizabeth Smart's father, Ed, joins us, so does the therapist who counsel Jaycee Duggard.
Later to Russia we go with asylum. Moscow lets the NSA leaker Edward Snowden leave the airport and stay in the country for a year. I'll talk to Edward Snowden's father, Lon Snowden, and why he now thinks that America's former Cold War adversary is the best place for his son.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KNIGHT: You deserve to spend life in prison. I can forgive you, but I'll never forget.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Michelle Knight today talking about the man who imprisoned her for 11 years, a third of her young life.
A psychologist also testifying today saying that Michelle, Amanda Berry and Gina DeJesus all now face life sentences of their own as they try and heal. Amazingly in her statement today Michelle Knight was already looking beyond herself and her two friends.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KNIGHT: With the guidance of God, I will prevail and help others that suffered at the hands of others. Writing this statement gave me the strength to be a stronger woman. After 11 years, I am finally being heard and it's liberating.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Remarkable sentiment for someone whose been through so much herself.
Here to talk about what they're going through, Ed Smart, whose daughter Elizabeth was abducted when she was 14 years old, spending nine months in captivity, also family psychologist Rebecca Bailey, personal therapist to kidnapping survivor Jaycee Duggard. She's co- author of "Safe Kids, Smart Parents: What Parents Need to Know to Keep Their Children Safe."
Ed, let me start with you. How do Michelle Knight and Ariel Castro's other -- the other women who survived, how do they move on? I mean, how do you begin this process?
ED SMART, ELIZABETH SMART'S FATHER: Well, I mean, I think today was one of those points where they can start moving forward because when you don't know whether you're going to have a trial or whether there's going to be a plea deal, I mean, there is always that anxiety of, you know, what am I going to have to face? What am I going to have to do? Do I have to relive this nightmare? Can it just be over with? Can't we move forward?
And you know, I think there is a lot of -- a lot of people that think, well, it's very empowering and certainly, for some, it may be very empowering, for others, it can be crippling and make life very difficult for them. I think the fact that they've been able to pretty much stay out of the limelight is a good thing, whether they decide to -- I mean, as Michelle was saying, help other people or whether they decide to just start moving on, living their life and finding a new life is each of their own choices.
So I'm excited for them. They have this opportunity of having this behind them at this point. Certainly, it was, you know, a huge point for our family to have Mitchell sentenced and to have the ordeal over with.
COOPER: And Rebecca, you and I have discussed this before, and one of the women echoed it in her video tape statement. She said, you know, this is something that happened to me or done to me, it's not who I am. It would seem to me that's a key point to -- for anybody who survives something like that to really -- not only intellectually understand but to really emotionally feel.
REBECCA BAILEY, CO-AUTHOR, "SAFE KIDS, SMART PARENTS": Absolutely. And understanding that you can move forward past the event. And I agree 100 percent with what Mr. Smart said of this being a day that they were all able to make choices, whether they were in court or not, and to move forward and begin the process of deciding where they want to go from this point. So a very important day.
COOPER: And Rebecca, I want to play something else that was said in court today. Let's listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KNIGHT: You took 11 years of my life away, and have I got it back. I spent 11 years in hell. Now your hell is just beginning. I will overcome all this that happened, but you have faced hell for eternity. From this moment on, I will not let this define me or affect who I am. You will live, I will live on.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Rebecca, what have you learned from survivors? I mean, that people who are watching this now can apply in their own lives in different ways? I mean, I'm always fascinated why some people are able to survive the worst, the most unimaginable things and others aren't.
BAILEY: Well, again, I think it's the meaning that you make out of it, out of the event that occurs and it's pretty soon for these girls to really get an understanding of that, but clearly, they are beginning to grasp that. It's the meaning, as you move forward, as you move beyond the event and --
COOPER: So you have to create a meaning about it or a narrative about it?
BAILEY: Some narrative in -- to make sense of it because it's such a senseless act. The things that these women have endured, what Elizabeth Smart endured, what Jaycee Duggard, it is senseless. I was in -- I was saying earlier that a psychopath in there, they never have to say they're sorry. They never feel it. They never have to experience it. That's part of the seduction of being a psychopath in my mind.
But understanding that and being able to move forward is the ability to let go that the event or the events that happened to you define who you are for the rest of your life.
COOPER: And Ed --
BAILEY: Really important piece.
COOPER: Ed, Elizabeth, as you mentioned, testified against her captor and read a statement in court during his sentencing hearing. Cameras weren't allowed in the court but I want to play a bit of what she said immediately afterwards. I want to listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ELIZABETH SMART, KIDNAPPING VICTIM: I told him that whether -- I told Ryan David Mitchell today in court that whether he received his just sentence here on earth or after this earth life, that one day he will have to be responsible for his actions.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: How did you prepare your daughter as a family to sit in that courtroom, to face that person?
SMART: You know, I think one of the most important things that, you know, the prosecutors did was to help Elizabeth understand why she was doing this, and that this wasn't necessarily a choice, it was something she just had to do, and they worked with her to help her understand, and I think that preparing for it enabled her to be able to get up there and do it, and I think that that is something that takes time.
I mean, I can't tell you how worried I was initially when Elizabeth came home and wondered what kind of hell she was going to have to go through, and, you know, I would have certainly preferred this plea deal at that time and yet nine years later, Elizabeth was able to get up there and Mitchell was such a coward he did his singing and had to be escorted to another room and only heard her voice rather than really see her.
But I think that each person gets to that point in their own due time and maybe some people don't even get there, but I think to be able to say, I'm not going to let -- this is not me. What you did to me was not me is such an important point. And it's at that point that you can say, you know, this wasn't me. I'm moving forward. This is -- this is me. This is -- this is not what everyone knows of me, but this is me.
COOPER: And Rebecca, you've written about what parents can tell their kids and how to keep kids safe. Do you think there's value? Because, I mean, I found their value today in looking in this man's eyes, seeing this man's face, and seeing that you know what, this is what a psychopath looks like and it's not necessarily on the face of it someone you would pick out of a lineup as being a monster.
BAILEY: I agree. Absolutely. That's why we say the notion of stranger danger doesn't really work because there is no absolute prototype of what they look like.
I also wanted to add that Jaycee chose not to be in court and I just -- because I think as Ed pointed out earlier, there is so many individual differences in how people process because she chose to not give him another minute of her life. And that was what she said and said publicly. And again, so each person has to come to terms with how they want to handle an event, and for some people sitting in that courtroom is the most important thing in the world and for other people to process it elsewhere with people, you know, that support them and love them can be as equally as healing.
COOPER: Ed Smart, Rebecca Bailee, thank you so much for being on today. I really appreciate it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you so much for having us.
COOPER: As always, you can find out more on this and other stories at CNN.com.
Just ahead, what life has been like for Ariel Castro's neighbors since his horrific crimes were exposed and why at least one man is moving away?
Also tonight, the NSA leaker Edward Snowden has a lot more leg room. He is free to roam anywhere in Russia for the next year. I'll talk to his father, Lon Snowden, about Russia's decision to grant his son asylum.
COOPER: Welcome back. As Pamela Brown reported earlier at Ariel Castro's sentencing hearing, a model of his house in West Cleveland sat in the courtroom as prosecutors and witnesses described in horrific detail what he did to his three captives over the course of a decade. For the first time, we also saw photographs taken inside the house. We learned just how bleak the prison was. Under the plea deal he made, Castro will have to pay to have the house at 2207 Seymour Avenue torn down. For his neighbors, that moment cannot come soon enough. Randy Kaye reports.
RANDI KAYE, CNN INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On Seymour Avenue, where Ariel Castro once lived, residents want one thing, they want their neighborhood back.
DANIEL MARTI, NEIGHBOR: He's history. That's all that is. So, we just want our neighborhood to be back to normal.
KAYE: Back to normal for Daniel Marti who has lived here 48 years, means no more police cars, no more satellite trucks, and no more authorities funneling in and out of Castro's home. Marti says he's proud of the women who escaped. He just saw Gina Dejesus yesterday. He calls what Castro did monstrous.
(on camera): Is it hard to look across the street and stare at the house?
MARTI: That house should have been torn down yesterday, for real. We don't like it.
KAYE (voice-over): This man is so disgusted by what happened here, he's moving out of the neighborhood. He says too many strangers are blaming neighbors for not catching on to Castro's scheme. (on camera): You feel like people blame you --
ANIBAL SANTIAGO, NEIGHBOR: They blame everybody.
KAYE: They blame everybody in the neighborhood because the girls weren't rescued?
KAYE: How does that make you feel?
SANTIAGO: I feel bad.
KAYE (voice-over): He says Castro's home has become a tourist attraction. He's sick of it.
(on camera): Soon there won't be anything to see here anymore. As early as next week, Ariel Castro's home will be demolished, all part of his plea agreement. The land it sits on is expected to be turn into a neighborhood park.
(voice-over): While some here will be happy to see the house go, Verdi Adams thinks it's a bad idea to have kids play on the spot where such horror occurred. He would like the house to be turn into a museum, a reminder to parents to keep a close eye on your children. He lives behind it.
(on camera): Is it over or does this neighborhood struggle with it?
VERDI ADAMS, NEIGHBOR: I don't think it's completely over because the man got away with it for ten years. He made a mockery of our judicial system.
KAYE (voice-over): Adam said the whole ordeal hurt has his tattoo business. He's ready to move on.
ADAMS: I have Cleveland police sitting here on the driveway, the street and a lot of my clients don't affiliate themselves or like to be adored by Cleveland police themselves.
KAYE (on camera): So your business took a hit?
ADAMS: Yes, it took a nice one.
KAYE (voice-over): At the church just down the block from Castro's home, Reverend Hoyer has been busy these last few months offering comfort to neighbors.
REVEREND HORST HOYER, IMMANUEL EVANGELICAL LUTHERAN CHURCH: I hope that with God's help I can do it. I can convince them they should not have guilt feelings because if they had known, they would have helped. If you don't know what is going on and comes to a complete shock, you're the victim as much as they are.
(END VIDEOTAPE) COOPE: Randy joins me now live from Cleveland. Did the reverend talk about the women who were kept inside that home at all?
KAYE: He did, Anderson. He talked quite a bit about them. He said that he has really found some peace in knowing that these women were living just down the street and that's because he believes they were able to hear his church bells ringing on Sundays. He believes they heard them twice ringing on holidays and given him a whole lot of peace. He said not even Ariel Castro is able to keep that beautiful sound of his church bells from coming through the walls of his home and into the ears of those women. He said those bells gave those women, hope, the hope to carry on and confidence they would one day be free.
COOPER: Randi, thanks very much. Appreciate it.
Just ahead, Edward Snowden walked out of the Moscow airport today after Russia granted him temporary asylum. He's in an undisclosed location. His father is making plans to go to Moscow at some point to see his son. Lon Snowden joins me ahead.
COOPER: Edward Snowden granted temporary asylum in Russia. I'll talk with his father next.
COOPER: We don't know exactly where in Russia Edward Snowden is tonight, but he's no longer hold up in the transit area of the Moscow airport. By now, you probably heard the Russia gave the NSA leaker temporary asylum. He'll be able to live and work in Russia for a year. The White House says they were not given a heads up.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAY CARNEY, WHITE HOUSE SPOKESMAN: We are extremely disappointed that the Russian government would take this step despite our clear and lawful requests in public and private to have Mr. Snowden expelled to the United States to face the charges against him. He's not a dissident, whistle blower. He's charged with a crime.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: The White House says it is reconsidering whether President Obama will meet one on one with President Putin at the G20 Summit in St. Petersburg next month. Some in Congress are calling for a stronger response. In the meantime there are reports that Snowden is getting job offers.
Lon Snowden and his attorney, Bruce Fein, join me now. It's great to have you on the program again. Mr. Snowden, when you heard the news today, what did you think? What went through your mind?
LON SNOWDEN, EDWARD SNOWDEN'S FATHER: I was surprised. I didn't expect it, but I was thankful. It was a good day. A positive step, one more step of many. We have work to do here on U.S. soil. We being folks who are concerned about this surveillance, the unconstitutional surveillance programs and that really is where my focus is at the time.
COOPER: There is obviously the larger issue that you're now concerned about and also very personal issue of your son and his future. Have you spoken to him? Do you have any idea where he's gone? Do you hope to go there?
SNOWDEN: I have not spoken directly to my son and I don't intend to do so until the appropriate time and I believe that will be sometime. We communicated through people.
BRUCE FEIN, LON SNOWDEN'S ATTORNEY: I spoke this morning to (inaudible). He is the Russian lawyer that represents Edward in Russia. He is at the apex of the legal establishment there and we discussed the train of events needed for us to obtain visas to travel to Moscow and have an opportunity to discuss with his attorney the possibility of legal representation of Edward not United States, make certain all legal avenues are fully made known to Edward in deciding what he wishes to do, and if things go according to expectations, I would anticipate something like September 1 would be a time frame to think that the visit would be made.
COOPER: Lon, when we spoke last night, Bruce referenced the fact there might come a time when it's constructive to figure if there is a solution in the interest of all sides that honors due process and the highest principles in civilization. To you what does that look like? Do you see a time Edward could return to the United States or the conditions under which you could imagine that happening?
SNOWDEN: Well, certainly, I can imagine that. And we've been, again, trying to work to gain assurances that due process would be afforded to my son, but that just has -- that's been not there at this point. You've had people on, Lindsey Graham, Chuck Schumer, Adam Shift, they are using the same tired old tactics of now they are complaining about President Vladimir Putin, talking about Russian-U.S. relations, doing everything possible to distract the issues at hand instead of focussing on the programs. They lack the courage to focus on these programs. They do not want to be confronted. What the truth and most importantly American people well-informed and have the truth.
FEIN: Anderson, I would like to interject many members condemned Edward as a coward, why isn't he coming back despite the fact that they are the ones by convicting him of treason before a trial that have poisoned the atmosphere that would enable a fair trial.
COOPER: So you don't think he would get a fair trial?
FEIN: At present, in this atmosphere, no. There is not a single statement out of the attorney general or the president of the United States that Edward Snowden enjoys a presumption of innocence, a presumption of due process that is existing since magna carta, eight centuries ago --
COOPER: Is that something they need to publicly say -- FEIN: Of course, they do because there are people out there in their own party and even the Secretary of State John Kerry saying openly that Mr. Snowden is guilty of treason. So they do need to say that because it's not against the background of silence. This is the secretary of state making that statement on "Voice of America" the same time he's saying well we want a fair trial for Edward. That's not a way to get a fair trial. That's a way to get a jury rigged in advance.
SNOWDEN: It's hypocrisy.
COOPER: Do you believe -- I don't know if the word safe is right. Clearly, the Obama administration is upset about the Russian government and I would assume there may be fallout at the G20 and one would assume the Obama administration may continue to talk to the Russian government privately to revoke the asylum. Does that concern you? Do you trust this year-long asylum is what it is?
SNOWDEN: Well, I certainly have confidence in -- and again, it's a matter of trust, and based on what I have seen thus far, I have trust and faith and confidence in those people who have taken my son in and are trying to keep him safe and secure. Now do I think he's going to be in condition where he can be safe in public for some time? No. I think it's going to be a long time before my son can safely walk the streets and function as a -- as a normal human being. I don't know that that will ever happen again.
Certainly, there are people who are revenge. There are folks elected to function as leaders and function as politicians. So no, my son is not safe per se I do believe that the Russian government and his attorney and the rush people in general, they want to keep him safe and secure so I'm thankful he's in Russia.
COOPER: Bruce, there are some people watching this story tonight and I'll hear on twitter, who will say look, Edward Snowden is seeking asylum where the guy running it is a KGB officer and not interested in transparency in their own dealings and say if Edward Snowden is interest in transparency, why is he in Russia? Should people look where he is as a -- some sort of reflex of him or to you is it just this is where events have brought him?
FEIN: I think they need to look why he is in Russia and not in the United States. It's because we need to look at what we did to provoke the disclosures that he made and forced him to go abroad because he couldn't receive a fair trial with people convicting him of treason before he's even had a single day in court, before there has even been a chance to test the constitutionality of the criminal complaints.
That's the problem here. No one is trying to suggest that Russia or other countries may be human rights. We are controlling our own country and these are distractions of rectifying what is wrong in the United States. I say this not because the United States is worse than Russia. I think that's ridiculous. It's because we've only become a better country, patriots that save our country from its government if we are willing to look at our own errors and correct them before we start lecturing others.
SNOWDEN: I would like to say something, Anderson. I really hope the American people after the show will go to YouTube and watch his 12-minute video and the 7-minute video released sometime later. Listen to that. That is Ed Snowden. Listen to what he said because as the days pass and more information comes out, it's becoming much more difficult and virtually impossible for those in Congress in the intelligence committees to dispute what he said. That's the truth that needs to be heard, and that terrifies the members on these intelligence committees and folks in Congress, and, you know, as a matter of fact, they made it impossible for folks in the United States Army to even listen to those videos.
COOPER: Lon Snowden, it's good to have you on. Bruce Fein as well, thank you.
Coming up, why the State Department is closing embassies in the Middle East? We'll be right back.
COOPER: Susan Hendricks joins us with the 360 "Bulletin" -- Susan.
SUSAN HENDRICKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Anderson, the United States is temporarily closing embassies in the Midwest because of security concerns that includes facilities in Egypt, Libya, Iraq and Kuwait. One U.S. official tells CNN it's based on more than the usual chatter, but that a potential terrorist threat.
Defense attorneys for accused mob boss Whitey Bulger released photos of him that are meant to show his softer side including shots of him smiling and posing with his girlfriend. The attorneys will show these pictures to the jury if Bulger testifies, a decision they say he will make tomorrow.
Italy's high court has upheld former Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi's four-year prison sentence for tax fraud. He says the sentence is unfounded. Anderson, back to you.
COOPER: All right, Susan, thanks. We'll be right back.
COOPER: Ran out of time for "The Ridiculist." We'll be back at 11:00 Eastern Time tonight another edition of 360. Now a special CNN Films presentation of "Our Nixon" starts now.