Return to Transcripts main page
ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT
Second Possible U.S. Ebola Case as First Patient Dies; Interview with Rep. Buck McKeon
Aired October 8, 2014 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: OUTFRONT tonight, breaking news, a second possible Ebola case in Dallas on the same day the man at the center of America's Ebola scare has died.
Are more people in Dallas at risk?
Plus new screening procedures in five airports around the United States. Will it be enough to keep Ebola out of the U.S. considering it doesn't take effect for maybe even another week or so?
And the president at the Pentagon today, as ISIS makes gains. Is the United States' mission changing on the fly?
Let's go OUTFRONT.
Good evening, everyone. I'm Erin Burnett. And we begin OUTFRONT tonight with the breaking news. A second possible Ebola case in Dallas tonight. This is the same day that the first patient diagnosed in the United States with Ebola has passed away from the virus.
The two cases may be connected. Sergeant Michael Monnig was sent into the apartment where Thomas Eric Duncan was staying and reported that he had, quote, "some contact" with Duncan's family members. Today Sgt. Monnig sought emergency care, reporting possible exposure to the deadly virus.
Authorities raced to reassure a shaken public.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR MAHER MASO, FRISCO, TEXAS: While we are being told the risk is minimal, over an abundance of caution we are taking several actions to make sure that the public health, safety and welfare is protected.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Monnig's case has been transferred to the same Dallas hospital where Mr. Duncan died early this morning.
Duncan's doctors said that he fought courageously. He passed away after -- eight days after his diagnosis, obviously of course he had been showing symptoms and sought care well before that.
CNN senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen is OUTFRONT tonight from Dallas, outside that hospital.
And Elizabeth, what more can you tell us about Sgt. Monnig right now?
ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, we can tell you is that he's a deputy sheriff, Erin, and that he was inside the apartment where Duncan was staying. However it appears that he did not have contact with Duncan and he was inside that apartment, it would have been several days since Duncan had last been there. But let's listen to something that Monnig told reporters a couple -- last week.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SGT. MICHAEL MONNIG, CONCERNED HE MAY HAVE EBOLA: We did not receive any type of emergency equipment. Touched doors, touched lights, to turn on lights. That starts putting those question marks in your mind. You know, when you go home and then the next day you start hearing that equipment is being quarantined or asked to be bagged up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COHEN: Now I want to be -- I want to be clear that according to the CDC, Ebola can't live on surfaces for more than just a few hours and Monnig was in that apartment several days after Duncan had left -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. So, Elizabeth, I know that when it comes to Duncan himself, obviously he died this morning. Last night, you know, Jesse Jackson had been in the hospital, visiting with the doctors, came on the show and was going through the signs of improvement on the kidney side of things and the fever side of things. Then things, though, seemed to quickly take a turn for the worse.
COHEN: Right. And that's not unusual with this disease. Things can get better and worse very, very quickly. And I know that the family and Reverend Jackson have questions about what happened with his care. They want to know, for example, why he had to wait for nearly a week to get an experimental medication when other Ebola patients in the U.S. got it pretty much immediately.
They also want to know why he didn't get blood donated by an Ebola survivor so that maybe those antibodies could help boost his immune system.
Now his girlfriend Louise Troh, she had this to say in a statement. She said, "I trust a thorough examination will take place regarding all aspects of his care."
And, Erin, it was interesting. This was a relatively long statement and she thanked many people. The judge who has overseen this entire effort. She thanked community leaders, her pastor, she did not thank the doctors and nurses here -- Erin.
BURNETT: Obviously a very -- a very crucial thing. She said she wants there to be a thorough examination of what happened in that hospital. Elizabeth, thank you so much.
I want to bring in a colleague now of Sgt. Michael Monnig, Scott Guiselman, president of the Dallas Sheriff's Fraternal Order of Police.
Obviously, you've just heard, sir, this officer was concerned. She was showing symptoms of Ebola after entering the apartment.
What's your reaction to that?
SCOTT GUISELMAN, PRESIDENT, DALLAS SHERIFF FRATERNAL ORDER OF POLICE: Well, it's horrible. I mean, the last thing you want to hear is anybody you work with might contract some kind of virus like this while doing his job.
BURNETT: Monnig also said that he didn't have the proper equipment. You know, that they were sent into that apartment. The family was quarantined there. There were sheets and towels that Duncan had used and had not yet been disposed of around the apartment. He said that they didn't have any kind of protective gear at all when they went in.
My question for you is, do you know if your colleagues were told it was OK, go in the apartment at that time or did they know there was risk?
GUISELMAN: Well, from what I understand, Sgt. Monnig actually asked Zack Thompson if it's going to be OK to enter the apartment and he was told yes, it would be. But that is correct, we are not provided with any kind of hazmat suits or anything like that.
BURNETT: And they did directly ask, according to your understanding?
GUISELMAN: That's what I was told, yes.
BURNETT: Now there were others in the apartment that day. Do you know anything about them, whether they have -- obviously at this point we have no idea if he has something else that was wrong with him and does not have Ebola, awaiting the results of that. But do you know if anyone else who went in that day has felt sick?
GUISELMAN: Actually I've got a phone call about 10 minutes ago that two other guys have gone home that were in the apartment. I'm sorry, one guy was in the apartment and one guy drove Sgt. Monnig's vehicle.
BURNETT: Those two were around but you haven't heard that they are feeling ill?
GUISELMAN: I heard that they are feeling ill.
BURNETT: You heard that they are feeling ill. And do you know --
BURNETT: Do you know, are they going in also to seek care and try to get tested? GUISELMAN: That is what I believe.
BURNETT: OK. So your understanding is that there were three people who were in the apartment, from your sheriff's department who are now going in for tests.
GUISELMAN: There was two in the apartment, and then one had driven Sgt. Monnig's vehicle the next day before it got -- before they cleaned it.
BURNETT: OK. OK. I understand. And yet -- but you're saying three total?
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much. I appreciate your time, Scott Guiselman.
Obviously that is a new development here that we know. Again, according to what he's telling us, the president of the Dallas Sheriffs Fraternal Order of Police is that there are now three people who were either in that apartment or in the car of Sergeant Michael Monnig who are now going in -- again, according to what he understands -- to get tested because they are not feeling well.
I want to bring in Dr. Ian Lipkin now, director of the Center for Infection and Immunity at Columbia University's Mailman School of Public Health, and Dr. Alexander Tulleken -- van Tulleken with Fordham University's Institute of International Humanitarian Affairs.
Great to have both of you with us.
Let me just start with you, Dr. Lipkin. You and I have talked about this a lot. Obviously you just heard him now saying it's not one person who is possibly going to be tested, it's three. People are afraid who were in that apartment. Obviously the chances seem to be low that they could have been infected, but is it possible?
DR. W. IAN LIPKIN, DIRECTOR, COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY, CENTER FOR INFECTION AND IMMUNITY: Anything is possible in biology. This is -- it's true it's unlikely. And I think an abundance of caution is appropriate. The signs and symptoms of Ebola very early are not specific. It is like any other sort of infection. So -- and people might simply have psychological issues also which present as I'm just not feeling well. So we really need the tests.
BURNETT: Right. And --
LIPKIN: We need the tests.
BURNETT: And those tests, Dr. von Tulleken, don't -- it's not an immediate thing. You just go in and get a test. That's not the way it works.
DR. ALEXANDER VAN TULLEKEN, INSTITUTE OF INTERNATIONAL HUMANITARIAN AFFAIRS: No. Which undetected at the very early stages, there may be trying to -- very low loads of virus, they may be looking for antibodies which may not yet the -- if they have Ebola may not yet have made antibodies against it. So I think to actually clear them will require a period of observation.
BURNETT: What about the issue of whether they should have been in there? You just heard them say, look, that they went in this apartment. The family was in there that was being quarantined and as we know at this point they have not yet -- to our knowledge, shown any symptoms at all but there were sheets, towels that Duncan had been using that were in that apartment. They went in without any protective gear whatsoever. Should that have happened?
LIPKIN: I think that was ill-advised.
LIPKIN: Yes. I think that people who are going into these sorts of situation should be people who've been trained and have the appropriate personal protective equipment. And, you know, the point about making the diagnosis which we just -- my colleague just talked about is critical.
LIPKIN: I mean, so, in fact, what we now do, is if somebody is ill, we take one PCR test and we wait three days and we take another PCR test, and it's only after the second PCR test is negative do we exclude Ebola.
BURNETT: Right. And that obviously shows this will take time for them to know.
Dr. van Tulleken, now you have, as we've just heard, possibly three people from the sheriff's department who are in that apartment who are now seeking care for possibly -- they think they could be sick. It's been 11 days since Duncan had contact with the family members who are in that apartment. So direct contact. Didn't have direct contact with any of these individuals we talk about or these family members.
So far we haven't heard of symptoms. The incubation period is 21 days. When can you breathe a sigh of relief and say that they didn't get it?
VAN TULLEKEN: We say 21 days. This is -- it's really important to say this is a virus that we have not studied as much as other viruses. We don't have a huge number of cases in places where it's easy to study. So 21 days is the rule of thumb that we're working on. I think we can relax a bit more after 21 days and that would be the period at which you'd say, yes, OK, --
BURNETT: So every day that goes by, you don't necessarily feel better or more in the home stretch until you hit 21?
LIPKIN: Well, I'm not certain I agree with that. So in my view, most people become ill within seven to 10 days of exposure.
LIPKIN: So if you make it through that seven to 10 day period, the --
BURNETT: The risk go down.
LIPKIN: The high probability say the risks go down dramatically. 21 days is way at the outset. I mean, that's -- it gives us confidence in fact that when you get out to 21 days you really are cleared. But I'd feel much better if we hit seven to 10 days.
BURNETT: Once we hit them, which I should emphasize we are now at 11th since he had direct contact with anyone so that could be significant.
Let me just also ask you about how big this could get. You and I were talking the other day, and you said that if this is uncontained, up to 1.2 million people could die of Ebola. Right now 3700 people have died from Ebola.
LIPKIN: It is a tragedy. You know, we all agree. And the numbers that are projected -- I think Tom Frieden has raised his numbers, I think may even be 1.4 million now. They could go -- who knows where that could go? I mean, it's a matter of conjecture. What is important at present is we get there, we find ways to contain it, and everybody worldwide is now trying to send people with expertise, resources, supplies.
LIPKIN: But there's still much more we can do. And many of us are trying to do this. And I think my colleague's agency is very, very involved in this as is --
LIPKIN: And many others.
BURNETT: It is, though, a shocking number for people to think about.
LIPKIN: It is.
BURNETT: To go from where we are now to that number of people.
BURNETT: Understand this is not something that's just going to go away.
Thanks so much to both of you. Appreciate your time tonight.
And OUTFRONT next, did the hospital do everything it could to save Duncan? Here's the reality. His treatment was different from the treatment that the Americans with Ebola got. Those Americans survived.
Plus new airport screening for Ebola. Are fever checks and a questionnaire enough?
And airstrikes can't stop ISIS from taking Kobani. It's a crucial town on the Turkey-Syrian border. Does the United States have a plan to stop the feared massacre of more than 12,000 people?
BURNETT: Breaking news tonight, Dallas County Sheriff Deputy Michael Monnig has been transported to Texas Presbyterian Hospital with possible symptoms of Ebola. Monning was in Dallas -- the Dallas apartment where Ebola patient Thomas Eric Duncan had been staying. We also just learned from the president of the Dallas Sheriff Fraternal Order of Police that two additional officers are now feeling sick. He just told me he believe they are also going in for testing.
Thomas Eric Duncan is now the first person to die from Ebola on American soil raising questions about the treatment he got.
David Mattingly is out OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Thomas Eric Duncan's death leaves behind a trail questions about Ebola treatment and prevention that is more 5,000 miles long. Liberian health officials didn't suspect the sick woman Duncan assisted in Monrovia was infected with Ebola until after Duncan was already in the United States.
Five days after his arrival, an ailing Duncan goes to the hospital in Dallas and tells them of his recent travel from Africa, but they just give him antibiotics and send him home.
DAVID LESTER, VICE PRESIDENT, TEXAS HEALTH RESOURCES: Regretfully that information was not fully communicated throughout the full team. And as a result, the full import of that information wasn't factored into the clinical decision-making.
MATTINGLY: Duncan spends three days potentially exposing others before he's back, even sicker this time, in the hospital. It takes two days to confirm, he's infected with Ebola. Duncan's case is a sharp contrast to Doctor Kent Brantly and Missionary Nancy Writebol, America's first Ebola patients. Both were diagnosed in Africa and given an experimental drug ZMapp and flown to the United States under quarantine, the drug seemed to work.
NANCY WRITEBOL, EBOLA SURVIVOR: What a great, great nursing staff and what a great doctors.
DOCTOR KENT BRANTLY, EBOLA SURVIVOR: He treated me with expertise, yet with such tenderness and compassion.
MATTINGLY: Duncan was in the hospital for nine days when his girlfriend speaks from quarantine, begging that he get the same experimental drug.
LOUISE TROH, THOMAS ERIC DUNCAN'S GIRLFRIEND: I am asking God. I'm asking the American government, the same medicine they gave to the people that came from Liberia, the Ebola people that came, the people with Ebola that came. Please help save his life. He's too young to die.
MATTINGLY: But supplies of ZMapp are depleted. The hospital confirms Duncan was given a different experimental drug already in serious condition, his status doesn't improve.
Blood transfusion from Ebola survivors are also believed to provide antibodies to patients still fighting the disease. Doctor Kent Brantly today gave blood to one Ebola patient on NBC cameraman. He also gave blood to an infected doctor who has since recovered. Both Writebol and Brantly confirmed they agreed to also give blood to Duncan, but it only works if their blood types match.
Now it no longer matters.
DOCTOR TOM FRIEDEN, CDC DIRECTOR: Today we are deeply saddened by the death of the patient in Dallas.
MATTINGLY: Duncan's case ends with the worst possible outcome. Brantly was out of the hospital in 19 days, Writebol out in 14. After finally being admitted, Thomas Eric Duncan, died in 11.
David Mattingly, CNN, Atlanta.
BURNETT: Joining me again is Doctor Alex Van Tulleken with Fordham University Institute of International Humanitarian Affairs.
You just heard David reporting, you know Doctor Brantly and Nancy Writebol offered to donate blood to Duncan, that didn't happen. The question is would a blood transfusion have helped?
DOCTOR ALEX VAN TULLEKEN M.D., FORDHAM UNIVERSITY INSTITUTE OF INTERNATIONAL HUMANITARIAN AFFAIRS: This is one of those things that refills like it would help because their blood has antibodies against Ebola. In it, that they made to survive the disease and you can take those antibodies out put it to somebody else. So that is the logic behind given the blood transfusion.
But the virus is already having a pretty devastating effect on his body by the time he would have got the transfusion. We don't know how much antibodies they got in their blood.
VAN TULLEKEN: And so, this is still highly experimental. We don't have data to say this works. We have a kind of logic that says it might work and it feels like it should work.
BURNETT: All right, so that didn't happen and obviously there could a blood type issue, I mean it's not 100 percent sure why it didn't happen at that point.
VAN TULLEKEN: So we don't know exactly. We don't know.
BURNETT: OK. Now what about the ZMapp itself, right? We're told there's just none of it last. And lot of people say, well of course there has to some of it last if the President of the United States had Ebola surely they'll be on ZMapp dose for him?
VAN TULLEKEN: It is a very interesting question that I see. So I don't -- I don't think they are holding any in reserve for him or anybody else? I mean, it takes a long time to make this stuff because the anti --
BURNETT: Because it grows in a plant.
VAN TULLEKEN: It is growing in a tobacco plant. And plants take a long time to do anything, OK. It is not like you're growing it an overnight. It's not that we have a machine that can print these things automatically. So they are scaling up a highly experimental drug that was really being researched at pretty slow pace until very recently.
BURNETT: So A, you buy but they don't have it and it takes a long time and, B, we don't even know for sure that ZMapp works. We it is -- it's been indicated in a couple of people had it --
VAN TULLEKEN: Yes.
BURNETT: That it helped but we don't know that it is a cure.
VAN TULLEKEN: That seems right. And I think speaking for the same, I mean, if you look at the share price of the amount in pharmaceuticals it sold since the Ebola epidemic started. They'll be desperate to get this drug in anyone. So I don't think they going to covered for the full of it that they are saving for some, you know, real American or whatever other thing we might, whatever other story we could tell.
BURNETT: So then, my other question that people might have is look, the people -- other people, Americans who came back with the disease, who did get slightly different treatment and survived, they went to hospitals that were chosen, hospitals that were ready that were prepared for this. The Dallas Presbyterian was not.
Is that something that could have played the role?
VAN TULLEKEN: I think there is no question that if you go to any Emory Hospital Atlanta they have absolutely know what they are doing. They've looked after other people with hemorrhagic fevers. You know and other centers patrol (ph) the disease around the world are also good at that.
VAN TULLEKEN: When you go to a regular hospital but doesn't deal with this kind of stuff people aren't drilled, they don't trained, and so it is not just a matter of having the copy of the CDC protocols somewhere, it's not just having a gowns in a covered.
VAN TULLEKEN: You can get anyone (INAUDIBLE). It is very nerve- wracking doing it. It is very easy to make a mistake. So I think there's no question. If I was running a hospital right now, I would be up thinking how do I get may stuff try this, how do I make staff easier to do?
BURNETT: All right Doctor Van Tulleken, thank you very much.
And officials are now taking new steps tonight to prevent an Ebola outbreak in the United States. Five major U.S. airports will begin additional screening for passengers arriving from Ebola stricken areas in West Africa. They say they going to take everybody's temperature. Again, we should emphasize 21 day incubation period. They could take your temperature and you could have Ebola and it won't show up positive.
Rene Marsh is OUTFRONT from the Washington Dulles International Airport.
RENE MARSH, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In just days, ramped up screening of passengers will begin at New York's JFK Airport and expanding to Atlanta, Newark, Chicago and here at Washington Dulles.
FRIEDEN: These five airports represent about 94 nearly 95 percent of all of the 150 travelers per day who arrive from these three countries.
MARSH: Anyone traveling to the U.S. from Ebola hotspot, Guinea, Liberia or Sierra Leone will have their temperature checked, with the laser thermometer. No touching necessary, just held close to the forehead. And new CDC questionnaire must also be filled out upon landing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's a 21 day incubation period, people may not have a fever when they passing through the airport and invariably (ph) when a case comes through, people are going to asking, we had this temperature screening and why did this happen? And I'm telling people it's complexly predictable that it will happen because this is not a full proof way to prevent Ebola from coming in into the country.
MARSH: Similar screening is already in place in West Africa. But the goal of these new U.S. checks is to identify passengers, airport officials missed or who developed symptoms while traveling.
Health officials say Thomas Eric Duncan did not have symptoms when he arrived in the U.S. so a temperature check would not have raised red flags.
JOSH EARNEST, WHITE HOUSE DEPUTY PRESS SECRETARY: This is an additional layer of screening that can be targeted to that small population, in a way that will enhance security but also minimize disruption to the broader traveling public.
BURNETT: And Rene, I mean it's -- it's pretty amazing that you went out, you were able to buy a laser thermometer to corner drugstore, how come agents won't start using those sort thermometers until this weekend and on some cases on some of the biggest airports in this country until even longer than that.
MARSH: Well Erin, I asked that very question. And you know, what I'm told is essentially they have to get the personnel in place. We do know that there will be ramped-up manpower at these five airports, so they have to get the people in place, they have to get them briefed on the procedures. They also have to be trained by CDC.
Now I know it's sounds simple, but they say that CDC has to walk them through it, let them know, once again refresher, what do you looking for, how do you use one of these things. They'll be using something similar to this. Make sure they know exactly what they are doing because remember these customs offers they're just that, they are not doctors. So CDC will be leading this every step of the way and they need the extra time to make sure everyone knows what they are doing.
BURNETT: And of course, Rene as we know, this just takes one person obviously for something horrible to happen. The five airports, according to my understanding that are going to be getting this and starting to do this, again days from now, represent 94 percent to 95 percent of the travelers who could come from an Ebola country.
That leaves five to six percent who aren't getting tested at all?
MARSH: Right. So the situation is a majority. According to the White House and the CDC, the majority of people coming from these three countries impacted by Ebola are going to come through those five major airports.
Sure, you may have one or ten coming in through another international airport someplace else but the number is not as significant as the number coming through those five airports so that's why they are pushing all the resources there.
That being said, it doesn't mean that there will not be checked that those other international airports. We still have CDC officers who were supposed to be looking for visual signs of sickness and we know that at 20 international airports, CDC representatives are on hand and we have quarantine rooms there as well. So if someone is detected at one of the other airports, not in the five that we spoke about today, the procedures are in place to pull that person out and give them a closer look -- Erin.
BURNETT: Thank you very much, Rene Marsh.
And OUTFRONT next, as ISIS tighten its grip on that crucial town of Kobani then Pentagon says American airstrikes will not save the town. So is the entire U.S. mission changing?
And hundreds of tips flooding in after all out alert for this English speaking militant, but is the FBI any closer to knowing who he is? (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Breaking News, new American airstrikes against ISIS, nine today, in Syria three and in Iraq as the President Obama met with his top military advisers at the Pentagon to discuss the U.S. strategy against ISIS.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Our strikes continue alongside our partners. It remains a difficult mission as I indicated from the start. This is not something that is going to be solved overnight.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So far, the total, at least 274 airstrikes against ISIS in Iraq, 125 in Syria. The cost of the now 61-day campaign, it has been 61 days everyone -- 7 million to 10 million bucks a day.
And still ISIS is gaining ground.
Jim Sciutto is OUTFRONT at the Pentagon.
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A U.S. B-1 bomber in the skies over Kobani -- a rescue that Kurdish fighters battling ISIS there have been desperately hoping for.
Military commanders say coalition airstrikes, six in the last 24 hours, have helped push ISIS back.
Today, Pentagon spokesperson, Admiral John Kirby, bluntly warned that the U.S.-led air campaign will not save Kobani -- or for that matter, any other number of Syrian towns under ISIS assault.
(on camera): Hearing the public in effect, for the fact that not just Kobani but other Syrian towns may fall over the long haul of this air campaign until you have those competent forces on the ground.
ADM. JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON SPOKESPERSON: I think we should all be steeling ourselves for that eventuality. Yes.
SCIUTTO (voice-over): The training, once it starts, say U.S. officials will likely take months more.
KIRBY: There is a lot of work still left to do, which is why we were very honest about the length of time, three to five months until we can get through that process. That's before you even start doing any of the training.
SCIUTTO: Until then, the goal for U.S. and coalition airstrikes is not taking back territory, but destroying ISIS command and control, its heavy weapons and oil depots -- targets that Secretary of State John Kerry said in effect take precedence over protecting a besieged population.
JOHN KERRY, SECRETARY OF STATE: We are trying to deprive ISIL of the overall ability to wage this, not just in Kobani, but throughout Syria and into Iraq.
SCIUTTO: In Iraq, where the U.S. does have partners on the ground and the Iraqi and Kurdish security forces, U.S. officials say that territory does matter, and they claim victories in retaking the Mosul dam, the Haditha dam, and protecting Irbil and Baghdad from other ISIS advances.
Still, the map of ISIS-controlled territory in Iraq looks much the same today, 61 days into the air campaign, as it did before the bombing started.
SCIUTTO: Of the nine strikes in Syria, we've just heard about eight of those were around Kobani. U.S. commanders say they are watching closely, that those Kurdish fighters are holding ground there.
But, you know, as the president visited the Pentagon today to speak with his military commanders about ISIS and other, former President Jimmy Carter took aim at the president's strategy. He said that the president, in Carter's words, quote, "took too long to confront ISIS."
That, Erin, and, of course, criticism that's come from within his own administration, from members of his own administration, including his former defense secretary and CIA chief, Leon Panetta.
BURNETT: Yes, absolutely, and now a former president. Thank you very much, Jim Sciutto.
And joining me now is Republican Buck McKeon, chairman of the House Armed Services Committee.
Chairman McKeon, you just heard what Jimmy Carter said, that President Obama, quote, "waited too long to go after ISIS." You know, Bill Clinton two weeks ago told me he supports the president. General Stanley McChrystal told me, this is the time to support the commander- in-chief, and no plan is perfect. But that is what is best of the might and greatness of the United States right now.
Who do you agree with?
REP. BUCK MCKEON (R), CALIFORNIA: Well, they are both right. The problem is it's not what he should have done. We're past that. Now, we need to talk about what he should be doing now.
Two months into this air attack, it's obviously not working. The strategy is not working. ISIL continues to get stronger on a day by day basis.
Kobani is about to fall. That's right on the border with Turkey. Turkey is a member of NATO. This could draw into a much, much bigger war. The longer we wait, the harder it's going to get. Our military
commanders, chairman of the Joint Chiefs, Dempsey, and chairman of the Army, General Odierno, General Austin, the area commander, they have all laid out scenarios where we need more troops. If we don't put boots on the ground, we can't form the coalition, we can't retake ground that needs to be taken and held.
BURNETT: So, let me ask you, when you say don't wait any longer and you are talking about combat boots on the ground, are you then now saying there should be American combat boots in mass and that's what it should be?
MCKEON: No, I'm not saying that we need to have tens of thousands of troops. What I am saying is troops are necessary to call in the targets on the appropriate areas.
BURNETT: How many -- I'm sorry to interrupt you, how many? Because they have a couple of thousand in there now. Now at the brigade level of the Iraqi army trying to help them. I mean, how many is enough?
MCKEON: If I were the commander-in-chief, I would suggest that he listen to his military leaders. They would give him the numbers that he should follow. I know that they've asked for more than they've been given. It is time that he'd follow their advice.
I know he met with them today and then went to New York and is holding three fundraisers. You know, a couple of weeks ago I gave a speech and I said, it was -- it's good that he does indicate to the American people that this is really important, but his actions aren't showing that he really feels it's that important. I think what he needs to do is follow their advice and be true to the American people, be honest to them and tell them, this is going to take a big effort. It's worth the fight. But if we don't get engaged --
BURNETT: So, let me ask you, because obviously, publicly, the generals so far have said they have not yet asked for more troops. They said they would be honest if they wanted them but haven't asked yet for them. So, you are saying you know they have asked for more than they've gotten?
MCKEON: Well, let me just say, they are in a tough position. He is the commander-in-chief. They are not going to disclose what they privately tell him. I just think that we could be pretty confident that they have told him they need more than they've been given.
BURNETT: OK. All right. That point then made loud and clear.
But in terms of what the president should do, in terms of the boots on the ground, even so, what you are saying is not -- not a mass amount of troops. More troops but not tons, and that somebody, the president has said this, sounds like I know you have also agreed on this one point, that other countries need to be putting in the lion's share of troops. But when it comes to other countries it is a painful sound of silence. So, if it comes to a choice: lots of American troops or ISIS wins, what's the choice?
MCKEON: If it were me, and that was the only choice, I would put in the troops. That is what we have a military for.
You know, the week after the president gave the speech and told how serious this threat was, he went to Atlanta and committed billions of dollars and 3,000 troops to go fight Ebola. They are not trained to do that. They are trained to meet and conquer an enemy. That's what they are trained to do.
We keep cutting their resources. We cut a trillion dollars out of our national defense and ask them to do more and more. It doesn't make sense.
The military has a purpose. They have a function, and it is to protect us against these threats. We should use them when we need to.
BURNETT: All right. Chairman McKeon, thank you so much. I appreciate your time and it's always good to talk to you, sir.
MCKEON: Thank you. Thanks, Erin.
BURNETT: And next OUTFRONT, the FBI aggressively following hundreds of leads, and a global manhunt for the militant seen in this ISIS video. Who is he and where is he from?
Plus, CNN's Mike Rowe gave advice, take the reverse commute. He says following your passion isn't the way to go.
BURNETT: Breaking news at this hour: the FBI is now reviewing hundreds of tips in their manhunt for a masked terrorist who appears in an ISIS video, speaking fluent English with the North American accent, apparently carrying out a mass shooting of Syrian soldiers.
Deborah Feyerick is OUTFRONT.
DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In the ISIS propaganda video titled "Flames of War", the self-proclaimed ISIS fighter is dressed in desert camouflage, a black face mask covering all but his eyes and thick brows. He makes no secret of his location or his intent to kill Syrian soldiers.
ISIS FIGHTER: We're here in the 17th division military base just outside the city of Ar-Raqqah. And we're here with the soldiers of Bashar. And you can see them now digging their own graves in the very place they were stationed.
FEYERICK: It's no secret either, that the terrorist speaks in what appears to be perfect American or North American English.
ISIS FIGHTER: And behind them you can see the officer's residence filled with bullet holes and artillery shells from the Islamic State.
FEYERICK: The FBI is now working aggressively to identify who he is and where he comes from. MITCH SILBER, K2 INTELLIGENCE: The question is, are there people here
in North America who might act on this person's behalf or might act as part of conspiracy with them.
FEYERICK: Mitch Silber runs the NYPD intelligence analysis division. He and others confirmed FBI investigators across the country are reaching out to religious and civic leaders in the Muslim community.
SILBER: Do they know people who have traveled recently to Turkey, or to Greece or Syria, and have not come back and have not been in communications with their family or friends?
FEYERICK: The FBI knows about a dozen Americans fighting in Syria, but it is what the feds don't know that troubles them. So, forensic analysts are looking at mannerisms, speech patterns and voice quality.
(on camera): Is he Arabic? Is he -- is English his first, his second language? Is Arabic his first language?
PAUL GINSBERG, FORENSIC AUDIO EXPERT: It's difficult to tell, just listening straight through. There are people in intelligence agencies right now in teams who are dissecting each and every word.
FEYERICK (voice-over): Evidence specialist Paul Ginsberg has worked audio forensics with the FBI.
(on camera): It is a very deep voice. Do you think that is his natural voice or do you think it's been altered?
GINSBERG: Well, that's another possibility. There is software and there are techniques to change the timber or the tone of a voice. And that can be done to try to thwart voice identification.
BURNETT: A pretty amazing step that they reached out to the general public for tips. They have gotten hundreds of them.
BURNETT: Obviously, you know, the vast majority are going to be false leads. But this shows how desperate they are to find out who this is. Is it the only person they are looking for that they could think could be American in the video?
FEYERICK: It's not. They are looking at everybody in the video, as a matter of fact. There is one man standing behind the main person, the English speaker, you can see right there, in the yellow shirt.
And so, they also want to know who he is because he stands out. He is wearing a white hood -- a white face mask, for example. You can see some of his hair. He looks totally uncomfortable and it looks like he is in the back going look at me.
But they are looking at everything. And they want to know who this American speaker or this North America speaker is because they don't know who he knows here in the United States and that's what's so critical. They want to make sure he doesn't get back in and they also want to make sure that if he knows anybody, that they are able to go and make sure there is no plot, no conspiracy, no possible hint of any attack that could occur here in the United States.
So, it's really crucial.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Deborah Feyerick. Hundreds of tips so far have come in in their mass public appeal.
OUTFRONT next, how often do you get the advice follow your passion? All the time, right? Isn't a Dr. Seuss thing that everybody gets for graduation. So, why does Mike Rowe say that is absolutely not the way to go?
Plus, the long-awaited "Ghostbusters 3" is on the way. No Bill Murray, no Dan Aykroyd, who are they going to call?
BURNETT: Let's check in with Anderson with a look at what's coming up on "AC360".
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, Erin. Yes, we'll have much more on the breaking news on the program. The possibility of another case of Ebola in Texas on the same day that Thomas Eric Duncan, the first person diagnosed in the U.S. with the disease, died. We'll have live reports from Dallas and those stories.
I'll also speak with Pastor George Mason who broke the news to Duncan's partner about his death and get reaction to his death from Duncan's home country in Liberia. Nima Elbagir has that angle. She's reporting from the frontlines.
Also tonight, we're digging deeper into the police officers accused of using excessive force during a traffic stop in Hammond, Indiana. It was caught on tape. As Susan Candiotti has learned it, isn't the first time some of the officers have faced such charges. Perspective on that from legal affairs commentator Areva Martin and legal analyst Mark O'Mara.
It's all the top of the hour, with a lot more, Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Anderson, we'll see you in just a few moments.
All right. Well, you've seen this guy doing a lot of odd jobs, milking camels, which is an awesome job, I've done it. Crawling through mines, even castrating sheep, haven't done it, don't want to.
And tonight, Mike Rowe joins the CNN family as the host of the series "SOMEBODY'S GOTTA DO IT." So, I talked to him a little bit earlier about the show and his controversial advice on how to get success.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) BURNETT: You're the type of guy that gets a lot of brouhaha going often online.
MIKE ROWE, SOMEBODY'S GOTTA DO IT: Brouhaha, is that a word, Erin?
BURNETT: Brouhaha, it's a word to me.
ROWE: All right.
BURNETT: All right. You went on Facebook recently -- a fan of yours said, following your passion, and asked you for advice and following your passion. And you said you know what, following your passion is not the way to go.
BURNETT: This is what caused the brouhaha. What were you saying?
ROWE: I'm saying there are a lot of lessons from dirty jobs. One of the big ones was I met a lot of people who were happy in their work but didn't follow their passion to get there. In other words, they found themselves in careers that were by no means the embodiment of their wish fulfillment.
They looked around, they saw where everybody else was going and they went the opposite direction. One guy in particular, who I was referring to in that post wound up in a septic tanks, cleaning septic tanks. It wasn't what he loved to do. He wasn't passionate about it, but he was great at it. He excelled at it. And he prospered at it, and he bought extra trucks and hired more people and learned to love it.
If passion is really as important as we're told, then we ought not follow it around, we ought to take it with us and apply it to whatever we're doing, in my opinion.
ROWE: The success stories that I prefer to highlight are ones that ultimately unfold because the people themselves are passionate irrespective and regardless of the circumstances of which they find themselves.
BURNETT: Which is -- which I look, I think it's a neat thing what you're saying. It goes to what you're saying, somebody's got to do it.
ROWE: Sure, I love people who figured it out by taking the reverse commute. Some people did follow their passion. So, it's not like there's a playbook for happiness but a lot of people didn't. A lot of people were passionate to start with and they ultimately found themselves in a place where that was rewarded.
BURNETT: In the show, you go one of these places, you go behind the scenes at an aquatic show to talk about what some people may not expect to be doing. I want to play a quick clip of that, as everyone prepared. Here you go, everyone.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROWE: That's right. Here's Chris. Chris told me my wet suit is on backwards and I might care when I go down to depth.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everything squeezes. You may want to change.
UNIDENTIFEID MALE: How does that fit now?
ROWE: It feels like a dream. It feels like Reve.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Take two. Nicely done.
ROWE: Yes, thanks. How are you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Good. How are you doing?
ROWE: I feel great. Thanks.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You'll feel better in the deep pool now.
ROWE: I bet.
But getting in water here, that's complicated. It's building suspense right.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Absolutely.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Thirty-five feet in the air and you just drop like an arrow.
ROWE: This show, it's called "La Reve". It's at I think at the Wynn Casino. And what's crazy about it is -- I saw it a year ago. I sat in the audience and I saw things that defy the laws of gravity. Boneless people bending in ways nature didn't intend, vanishing into a pool of flaming water and not resurfacing. And you sit there and you go, you know, how the heck did they do that?
So, I thought, you know, if I get the show off the ground that I wanted to do, one of the things I'd like to do is go back and find the person because there's always one person who's in charge of all of this stuff.
It turns out to be the greatest stage hand in the world. His name is dale. He is in charge of everybody's health and well-being in most dangerous show ever done in Vegas.
I spent a day with him. He let me try of things I probably shouldn't have been allowed to try. I came head to head with their PR guy who was a little nervous but who wound up becoming an interesting part of the show. And in the end, we leave with an appreciation for Vegas, risk, PR, immersive TV, and authenticity and storytelling, which I'm kind of happy about.
BURNETT: It's great show. You got to watch it. Don't miss "SOMEBODY'S GOTTA DO IT." It's tonight at 9:00, the debut.
OUTFRONT next: "Ghostbusters" is back with a surprising cast.
BURNETT: Tonight's money and power: "Ghostbusters" is back. Today, director Paul Feig tweeted, "It's official. I'm making a new Ghostbusters, and writing it with writer Kate Dippold and, yes, it will star Hilarious Woman, that's who I'm going to call."
Feig, of course, is referring to the famous line from the hit 1984 movie.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's something you don't see every day.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I tried to think of the most harmless thing, something I love from my childhood. Something that could never possibly destroy us, Mr. Stay Puff.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nice thinking ray.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Bill Murray has thought of a lot of thing including using in the cast, saying he'd like to see Melissa McCarthy and Kristen Wiig.
Anderson starts now.