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AT THIS HOUR WITH BERMAN AND MICHAELA
Republican View of Democratic Debate; Tensions Rising in Israel, Palestine; Democrats Debate Race Issues; Scoring in Debate Performance; Ivanka Trump Speakers Out. Aired 11:30-12p ET
Aired October 14, 2015 - 11:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[11:30:00] SEAN SPICER, CHIEF STRATEGIST & COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE: I think what people like about Bernie Sanders, he's very authentic. And that fact is, as Dan Pfeiffer, you had on earlier today, was saying that, you know, Bernie outdid Hillary. And I think that there's a big difference between what the rest of the American public wants to see, which is, is she being honest and trustworthy? What else is in those e-mails? Why did she have a set of rules for herself? What really happened in Benghazi? There's a lot of questions Hillary Clinton's not answering that still need to be answered.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Picking a fight with Donald Trump. He said Hillary Clinton, says no --
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Definitely, Democrats in the room agree that they were done with talking about the damn e-mails, though. We'll see how much more. And got the big damn investigation and her to testify later this month.
SPICER: We had a fun week.
BERMAN: Potty mouth.
BOLDUAN: I do have a potty mouth. Thank you for pointing that out.
BERMAN: Sean Spicer, thank you so much.
BOLDUAN: Great to see you, Sean.
We also have some new details. We want to make a big turn back overseas to Israel and breaking news we're following out of Israel. Israel police, they shot and killed a man who attempted to stab a private bodyguard at the Damascus Gate in Jerusalem.
BERMAN: Tensions have been so high in recent weeks. And the Israelis have imposed new security measures setting up checkpoints, soldiers on the streets in some cases in part of the city where you do not normally see them.
I want to bring in Fareed Zakaria, host of "Fareed Zakaria GPS."
And, Fareed, over the last few weeks, we have seen an extreme rise in the tensions in Israel. And frankly, extreme silence between leading Israeli authorities and leading Palestinian authorities about how to work through it. What happens now?
FAREED ZAKARIA, CNN HOST, FAREED ZAKARIA, GPS: I think you put it exactly right, John. This has caught everyone by surprise. And the reason is this is very much a bottom-up movement that seems to have emerged in the Palestinian communities. This is not top down. This is not directed by as far as we can tell Hamas or Fatah or Islamic jihad or any of those organizations. This is something that has come out of social media. This is young Palestinians, often no more than teenagers, who are, you know, self-radicalizing on the Internet, who are then going out and taking whatever weapons they have. In some cases, a knife. In one case, I think it was a potato peeler. And trying to do something to express their desire for a Palestinian state, opposition to Israel. And so nobody quite knows what to make of it. Obviously, none of them are really succeeding. The Israelis are in full control of the security situation. But I suspect that it's making everyone try to ask themselves what do you do with this new kind of bottom-up viral violence, if you will?
BOLDUAN: And, Fareed, the secretary of state, John Kerry, has announced he's going to be at some point heading over there to try to help quell the violence, to ease the tensions. What impact do you think Secretary Kerry can have? Do you think that is a welcomed addition to this volatile situation?
ZAKARIA: You know, I think Secretary Kerry has done a very good job in general. I think this is an area where he continues to overestimate the influence that he personally can have and frankly that the United States or any outside party can have. It is clearly -- it's a very depressing situation. Neither side seems really willing to have engaged in serious talks. The Palestinians remain divided between Hamas and Fatah and, therefore, can't really move forward in a unified fashion. And the Israeli government -- and this has been true for a while now -- is really not in the mood to have serious talks about a serious two-state solution plan. So I don't see what Secretary Kerry will be able to do. He tried very hard for almost a year. And I think it was frankly a wasted effort and it was a waste of his time and his political capital. I just hope he doesn't devote too much of it because it will come to nothing.
BERMAN: Certainly a situation on the ground, though, something needs to happen to try to make it better in the future, even if he's not the right person to do it.
Fareed Zakaria, thank you so much for being with us. Appreciate it.
Turning back to Las Vegas, debates as performance art. Who won the style points here in the first Democratic debate? We will talk to a debate expert, one of the most esteemed debate coaches in America.
[11:38:51]BOLDUAN: Ah, yes, good afternoon in some places, good morning for others, and hello. And even though you didn't go to sleep last night for many, many here in Las Vegas. We're live. Last night, the candidates going head to head, tackling issues like gun control and income inequality.
BERMAN: Not to mention race and Black Lives Matter.
I want to bring in CNN political commentator, Van Jones; and CNN senior political analyst, Ron Brownstein.
Van, one of the things leading up to this debate that was an open question was would Bernie Sanders make inroads? Because he hasn't really made any with African-American voters or voters of color. One of the moments in the debate last night that people are talking about today is when the candidates were asked about the Black Lives Matter movement. Let's listen to that exchange.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do Black Lives Matter? Or do all lives matter?
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS, (I), VERMONT & DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Black Lives Matter.
MARTIN O'MALLEY, (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & FORMER MARYLAND GOVERNOR: The point that the Black Lives Matter movement is making is a very, very legitimate and serious point.
HILLARY CLINTON, (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE: And we've got to do more about the lives of these children.
JIM WEBB, (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE y FORMER SENATOR: As the president of the United States, every life in this country matters.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: This said what to you, Van?
[11:19:58] VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, first of all, it's just an extraordinary acknowledgment of the young people who are a part of this Black Lives Matter movement. They don't have an office. This is a hashtag and passion. And yet somehow they've been able to get the entire Democratic Party to respond to them and to their concerns. And if you had talked to them standing there during Ferguson, during Baltimore, during Charleston, where they felt nobody cared, you have to admit people showed they care. The thing you've got to realize this is a party, the Democratic Party, that has to get not 70, not 80, not 90, but 92 percent of the black vote to win the general election. And so if you have young people discontent, you don't have the turn out, you can't win. These candidates are reaching out. Bernie Sanders did himself well last night to reach out as aggressively as he did.
BOLDUAN: And it's already a win for them. They made their message. They made it into the debate. There were a lot of issues that didn't make it in, in this debate.
JONES: There are organizations and issues that have been around for 10, 20, 30 years, not mention, this is a movement that's been around for less than 18 months, and they dominated. BOLDUAN: Another big issue -- Ron, I want to get your take -- because
you've talk a lot about this previously, gun control.
RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Right.
BOLDUAN: Big issue last night. There was a big moment of discussion on that. And essentially, they were all falling all over each other to say how much they're hated by the NRA and what a horrible grade that they have by the NRA. Some folks thinking, are they -- have they gone too far left on the issue? Because the traditional thinking, Ron, was that this is a geographical issue.
BOLDUAN: It seems that maybe they don't think that anymore.
BROWNSTEIN: I think it still is a geographical issue. The difference is now they can win with a geography and a different Democratic coalition. After Al Gore was defeated in 2000, the conclusion among Democrats starting with Bill Clinton was that he lost largely in states where the NRA was powerful like Arkansas, Tennessee and New Hampshire. And he lost it primarily because he struggled among blue- collar white voters who tend to be the most passionate opponents of gun control. 15 years later the Democratic coalition is in a very different place. It's more urbanized, coastal, more dependent on minorities and upscale whites who tend to be more supportive of gun control. And it was extraordinary to see that the only debate about gun control last night was Hillary Clinton attacking Bernie Sanders from the left.
BOLDUAN: Yeah, exactly.
BROWNSTEIN: Big change.
BERMAN: It's a good segue to where the party is right now. We don't have time to play the sound, but, Van, it was the last answer Hillary Clinton gave on who her favorites on her enemy might be. And she finished with Republicans. And it drew a big applause moment from the crowd. I'm old enough to remember when Barack Obama ran on making a purple America. Right? On trying to attract to the middle. Now it seems as if in a way both parties are falling all over themselves to appeal to the wings.
JONES: Both parties have moved very much in the directions of their constituents. Listen, I thought it was flawless. I thought Hillary Clinton was like Beyonce. She was flawless, except for that answer. I don't think we are in a place where you can say I'm trying to be president of the entire country, but I'm proud that half of America --
BOLDUAN: Is that an acknowledgment that she's lost Independents?
JONES: I don't know, but I was going to say the one issue that seems to bring people together is criminal justice reform. The only issue that was -- that people spoke about positively, both Republican conventions, and this, criminal justice.
BROWNSTEIN: John, I think the biggest point -- I agree with you -- the biggest point was how much the entire frame of the debate moved the Democratic party certainly from where Bill Clinton was in the '90s, even where Barack Obama started off. And while on cultural issues, I think Democrats are confident on things like gay marriage and providing a pathway to citizenship. On the role of government they outlined, it is still a much dicier proposition. Most Americans are not convinced that activists can make their life better. So the markers they put down last night I think will have resonance in the general election for whoever gets there.
BERMAN: Got to get there first, though.
Ron Brownstein, Van Jones --
BOLDUAN: Change the course of human history.
BOLDUAN: That's what the debate did.
BERMAN: Thanks, guys. Appreciate it.
BERMAN: Was it a big mistake or perhaps a best response? Bernie Sanders and his comment over Hillary Clinton's "damn e-mails." Those were his words. In the end, is it good or bad for his campaign?
BOLDUAN: And incredibly proud of her father. She's done very, very few political public events since her dad began his campaign, though she has a very public face, but Ivanka Trump is now speaking out today. That's ahead.
[11:48:54] BERMAN: We are live in Las Vegas where there was a debate last night, and a debate filled with substance and style. And the question this morning who scored the most points on policy but also performance.
BOLDUAN: Performance art, as John likes to call it. Brett O'Donnell, president of O'Donnell & Associates, is joining us now. He is currently the strategist for Lindsey Graham and he also helped to prep Mitt Romney and John McCain for presidential debates in the past.
Brett, it's great to see you once again.
And so, we had a preview yesterday with you in terms off what people needed to do in terms of the style, and the verdict is in. Hillary Clinton you said that the preparation showed last night and also the fact that she went on the attack, which surprised a lot of the folks on the stage. Here is one moment that you highlighted, Brett, and I want to ask you why -- listen to this -- gun control.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: And is Bernie Sanders tough enough on guns?
CLINTON: No, not at all. I think that we have to look at the fact that we lose 90 people a day to gun violence, and this has gone on too long and it is time for the entire country to stand up against the NRA.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[11:50:02] BERMAN: Why does this moment stand up to you, Brett?
BRETT O'DONNELL, PRESIDENT, O'DONNELL & ASSOCIATES: Well, because it is a decisive moment, and a moment where she exercised a competitive edge over the opponent, and it took him by surprise. His answer was weak and boiled down to geography and was very defensive, and looked like he was totally shocked that she attacked him for that issue.
BERMAN: And people were saying that Bernie Sanders was drawing a contract to Hillary Clinton, but it was Hillary Clinton --
BERMAN: Jumped on the opportunity
O'DONNELL: There was time after time last night she drew contrasts with him, whether it was on the capitalism or the gun control or foreign policy, and she was not shy about contrasting with Bernie Sanders.
BERMAN: Now, on the other hand, he was awfully nice, especially when it came to what many people considered her biggest vulnerability, which is the issue of the personal e-mail use for national business. And let's relive that moment when Bernie Sanders used the word "damn."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANDERS: The American people are sick and tired of hearing about your damn e-mails.
CLINTON: Thank you. Me, too. Me, too.
CLINTON: Thank you, Bernie. Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: Now Donald Trump, debate expert, says that is a bad move by Bernie Sanders because he took the issue off of the table. But you believe that maybe Bernie was smart there?
O'DONNELL: Yes, it is not good for him to attack her on the e-mail address, and the issue where he wants to draw the contrast is on the view, and the government's role in the lives of Americans in terms of distributing wealth. For him to attack her on the e-mail issue is going to be something that most Democrats are going to defend Hillary about. So I think it is smart. It's kind of the oldest trick in the debate book, which is to defend your opponent in the schoolyard against the bigger bully, and it makes her look small and you look big.
BOLDUAN: And also that hand shake that stuck out to me, because it feels like any physical contact --
BERMAN: The physical touch, the touching alarm goes off.
BOLDUAN: -- it's always bad.
BERMAN: Yes. Ding, ding, ding.
BOLDUAN: Real quick, Brett, was this bad or OK in the handshake?
O'DONNELL: It was fine, and she took it well. And it was not -- and she took the whole thing as a defense and that he was declaring a truce on that issue, and so I thought that it was a moment are where he was trying to usurp her on the issue, and say, look, I am not going to attack you on the e-mail issue, but I am going to draw a line on the economic policies.
BOLDUAN: Brett O'Donnell, always great to have you, Brett. Thank you for coming in.
O'DONNELL: Good to be with you.
BOLDUAN: Coming up, so you think that one Trump is not enough on the campaign trail? I think a lot of Republicans would say absolutely. Well, there are now two. Ivanka Trump just finished a speech in Washington. We're going to hear from her and find out more about her role in her father's campaign going forward.
[11:27:35] BOLDUAN: We are live in Las Vegas following the Democratic presidential debate. Let's talk about the Republicans. It's rare to hear from Ivanka Trump as it is rare to not hear from her front runner father
BERMAN: Donald Trump's daughter spoke at the Fortune 500's Most Powerful Women Summit in Washington, and as expected, she was asked about her father.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) IVANKA TRUMP, DAUGHTER OF DONALD TRUMP: Yes, I am incredibly, I'm incredibly proud of him. So as a citizen, I love what he is doing. And as a daughter, it is more complicated because of the level of interest and scrutiny is beyond anything I've ever experienced, and I think that is to be expected.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: So Donald Trump trusts her with his business, and she is a top executive of the Trump Organization, so will he actually rely on her for the presidential campaign? Will we be seeing m ore of her?
Here to discuss, our very own Christine Romans, CNN's chief business correspondent, anchor of "Early Start."
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.
And she is, and the old cliche of the secret weapon in politics, and it is usually someone's spouse, but this could be Donald Trump's secret weapon, because she is an incredibly accomplished woman who already runs a big part of his business. She is classy, well spoken, very adept with social media, and she's very, very smart and approachable. She says that her dad listen and he's an unbelievable businessman and he does trust women in positions of authority because he has her there running so much of his business.
She was asked about Megyn Fox, and the feud, and I have to tell you that she said it was sensationalized and the whole situation didn't interest her very much.
She does not say that she is going to work for her dad in a campaign role, but she is there in the business role with him every day, working in his business, and I will tell you, she is a powerful advocate for her father, guys.
BOLDUAN: Absolutely. Did she project how long she would be on the campaign trail? Donald Trump seemed to think she'd be there a lot.
ROMANS: Well, she did not project how much she's going to be out there, but I think this is the first foray of getting out there and answering the questions about him. She announced a couple of weeks ago she was expecting her third baby, so it is a very busy year for Ivanka Trump.
BOLDUAN: I'd say so.
Christine, great to see.
And a reminder to all of you. CNN's Poppy Harlow sits down with Ivanka Trump. See that whole interview today on "The Lead" with Jake Tapper, and also on Erin Burnett, "OutFront," tonight at 7:00 p.m.
And that is all for us.
Thanks for joining us AT THIS HOUR, Vegas edition.
BERMAN: And time for us to leave Las Vegas.
"Legal View" with Ashleigh Banfield starts now.