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AT THIS HOUR WITH BERMAN AND MICHAELA

Trump Criticized for Supporters Beating Protester; Security Tight, Fears High in Paris; Deadly Competition Grows Between al Qaeda, ISIS; Video to Be Released of White Chicago Officer Gunning Down Black Teen. Aired 11:30-12p ET

Aired November 23, 2015 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[11:31:00] PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: And with just 10 weeks until the Iowa caucuses, a brand new poll from ABC News and "The Washington Post," as we just discussed, shows Trump holding his 10-point lead over Ben Carson. But he's getting criticism for apparently defending how some of his supporters got physical with a protester at a Trump event in Alabama.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(SHOUTING)

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BROWN: CNN's Athena Jones joins us from Washington.

Athena, tell us more about this event and what happened there.

ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Pamela. You can see that video. It's pretty remarkable to watch what was going on. This was on Saturday at a rally in Birmingham. There was a big rally in Alabama on Saturday. You had a handful of Black Lives Matter protesters who tried to disrupt Donald Trump's speaking. They chanted, "Dump the Trump" and "Black Lives Matter." About half a dozen Trump supporters in the crowd tackled at least one of those protesters, a 31-year-old man. He said he was punched in the face, punched in the neck, kicked in the chest, kicked in the stomach, someone stepped on his hand. He said at one point, one person was trying to choke him. Protesters also said they were called the "N" word and "monkeys." So, it looks like a pretty rough situation there in Birmingham on Saturday.

BROWN: And Trump's response to this sort of created some waves, right?

JONES: Absolutely. Take a listen to how he responded to this on "FOX & Friends." He seemed to back up the supporters who handled the protester in that way.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & CEO, TRUMP ORGANIZATION (voice-over): The man you say was roughed up, he was so obnoxious and so loud, he was screaming. I had 10,000 people in the room yesterday. 10,000 people. And this guy started screaming by himself. I don't know, rough up, he should have been -- maybe he should have been roughed up because it was absolutely disgusting what he was doing. This was not handled the way Bernie Sanders handled his problem, I will tell you. But I have a lot of fans and they were not happy about it. And this was a very obnoxious guy who was a troublemaker, who was looking to make trouble. I didn't get to see the event.

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JONES: So, there you hear Donald Trump saying maybe this young man should have been roughed up. I should tell you that he made those comments to "FOX & friends" less than 24 hours after his campaign said he does not condone this kind of reaction. We heard Trump talk tough about these black lives protesters since the summer when several of them disrupted a Bernie Sanders event. They even managed to wrestle away his microphone. Trump said then, that's noting going to happen to me. If these protesters try to dot same thing at my event, they'll have a fight on their hands. I don't know if I'll do the fighting myself or other people will. We can see from that video that other people did do that fighting. The protesters have said they want an apology from Donald Trump. And the 31-year-old who was wrestled to the ground says that he plans to press charges against those supporters -- Pamela?

BROWN: Athena Jones, thank you so much.

Paris with a different feel, the pain, the guilt of surviving. CNN goes to the sites of each attack. Our first look there when we return.

Plus, ISIS versus al Qaeda, the dangerous rivalry now growing for which group can hit the West harder.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:37:54] BROWN: A frantic manhunt under way right now for one of the attackers who survived the Paris massacre and for the others who are behind the attacks. And for people living there, security remains tight and fears are high.

Our Brooke Baldwin is live in Paris. She visited each of the attack sites and spoke with residents about how they're beginning to cope with this tragedy.

Brooke, it's been a very busy 24 hours for you since you've been there.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I come at this at the perspective, so many people are watching. I haven't been in Paris. I was watching this unfold, the grief, the mourning, like all of you. And to be here -- I've been here a little more than 24 hours, you really feel it. Paris, truly, truly, for such a beautiful city of light, it feels different. I'll get to that in a moment. But, Pamela, if I may, let me step out of the shot. I want to explain

to you where we've been coming to you for the last week and a half. This is the Place de la Republique. Maybe a place you wouldn't frequent on your first or second trip to Paris. What this represents, this is about half a mile away from the cafe sites, Bataclan, the concert hall. You see all of these people coming to this entirely separate location, this square, because where you see everyone lighting candles and sitting still is a statue. On the statue, three very important words for the country of France, "liberty, equality and fraternity." That is, in essence, the people here in France.

And I'll step back in. I just wanted to give you a sense of what's happening here, two Mondays after those attacks just shattered this city. As I mentioned, when I landed at Charles de Gaulle Airport yesterday morning and pretty quickly wanted to visit and pay my own respects and also talk to Parisians. How does it feel? It seems to me that almost everyone I spoke with was somehow connected to a victim or, if they were lucky, a survivor of the tragedy two Friday nights ago. Again, it is a stunning city, but it feels different.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN (voice-over): Paris, beautiful Paris, in its second week since the horrific attacks, definitely feels different.

(on camera): Tell me when you heard, where were you?

[11:40:13] UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was in the cafe, inside, inside in the cafe.

BALDWIN (voice-over): Antonia, like so many other Parisians, still can't swallow the pain and the guilt of survival.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We can do nothing. We say, that's not possible, you know. Stay -- I'm sorry. I'm sorry. You know, I feel guilty, you know.

BALDWIN (on camera): Why do you feel guilty?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I feel guilty because we can do nothing.

BALDWIN (voice-over): Antonia was enjoying tea at a nearby cafe when she heard the Kalashnikovs ring out. Her daughter's best friend murdered.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My daughter's best friend. She's completely disaster. She can't see. It's difficult, you know, to -- to forget it. We will never forget it.

BALDWIN: So young. Even the youngest seem to understand something wrong happened here.

(on camera): And you're 11?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

BALDWIN: And I saw you just light a candle. Why?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For peace.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When she woke up on the Saturday, she saw us watching TV, crying. And we had to explain to her what was happening.

BALDWIN: Parents across Paris, fighting for the right words to articulate to their children, like 9-year-old Louise here, how so suddenly mommy lost a friend from work. Seems like almost everyone did.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We realize that everybody knows somebody.

BALDWIN (on camera): Does the city, does your home, does it feel different?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. Now we realize that we can be touched by this evil.

BALDWIN: Evil, yeah.

Tell me why you're here today.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because I'm -- I'm so sad it happened. That's why. In memory for all these people who were young and happy to live. That's all. And my daughter lives just around here, and she heard the Kalashnikovs.

BALDWIN (voice-over): Monique's daughter lives in this neighborhood where a number of young people were killed. Out enjoying a seasonably warm night in Paris. Her mother knows it could have been her. It could have been anybody.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They came with the car and they shot with the Kalashnikov, everybody.

BALDWIN (on camera): Does it change, Harris, for you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It changed a bit, of course. We're a bit more afraid.

BALDWIN (voice-over): Don't be mistaken, the city of lights, enlightenment and revolution, feels a tad tenuous at this time, but as Roger will remind you --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because it's city of love. When you come here, we don't see Jewish or something like that. You just see a human being.

Please come back and we can talk about this.

BALDWIN (on camera): Come to Paris?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, come to Paris.

BALDWIN (voice-over): Come back, because now more than ever, Paris needs you. Here we are on a Sunday in beautiful Paris and we're surrounded by

people.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

BALDWIN: That's a beautiful thing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, that's beautiful, yes. I like it. It makes something warm in the heart.

BALDWIN: Thank you so much. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Something warm in your heart. Just so grateful these different Parisians, you know, gave me the time yesterday to share how they felt. It's one thing to be an American, as we have been certainly attacked in the past and we know what it feels like to be touched by such tragedy, Pamela, but to be here and to hear from these people, it's -- it's something to behold.

BROWN: They're so resilient. I was there after the "Charlie Hebdo" attacks, Brooke, and I remember how much it struck me of how quickly they bounce back. We see it behind you there. The crowds are out. They are moving forward with their lives.

An incredible, powerful report there, Brooke. Thank you so much.

BALDWIN: Thank you.

[11:44:31] BROWN: And coming up, it's a growing terrorist rivalry with deadly consequences. Two sworn enemies of the United States now battling each other for the title of top jihadist organization. We'll go inside the fight between al Qaeda and ISIS.

Plus, did the Pentagon alter reports on ISIS to paint a better picture of the fight against the terrorists? President Obama, after taking heat for his tone, is now responding and makes a surprising admission.

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BROWN: Mali, under a state of emergency, begins three days of national mourning today as the death toll in Friday's terror attack on a luxury hotel climbs to 22. At least two terrorists groups are claiming to have carried out the attack. And by the time authorities went into the Radisson Blu Hotel, there was people already dead on the floor. Incredibly, though, many survived. Authorities are now on the manhunt is continuing for three suspects.

And if the attack on Mali was an al Qaeda response to the ISIS attack on Paris, it could be the spark of a global competition between the terror groups, each trying to outdo one another with new or deadly or more horrifying attacks.

Joining me is Paul Cruickshank, our terrorist expert.

Paul, thanks for coming on.

We have been talking about this idea for months, the competition between the two groups. Do you think that's what we're seeing place out right now?

[11:50:17] PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: There is no doubt about it, Pam. The spiraling war of words between al Qaeda and ISIS, and they hate each other. There's been actual fighting among the two group groups in Syria in the past few years on and off fighting. And there's competition in Syria for recruits, and fierce competition as well in Yemen, Libya and Afghanistan and Pakistan, and many other parts of the world, including in Mali, where we saw that attack on the Radisson Hotel, claimed by an al Qaeda aligned groups, and al Qaeda in the al Qaeda Maghreb, and also a group that a unit led by an Algerian al Qaeda terrorist, Mokhtar Belmokhtar. And one of the reasons al Qaeda at the local level in Mali may have launched the attack, is because they have a rivalry at the local level with an ISIS-aligned group called Mushou (ph), which was a part of the Belmokhtar set up in Mali, but split off in may of this year and actually pledged allegiance to Abu Bakr al Baghdadi. So throughout the region, throughout the world, we are seeing this rivalry play out between ISIS and al Qaeda for standing in the jihadi movement, for recruits, financing and prestige, and it is leading to one-upmanship when it comes to plotting international terror. Over the years, al Qaeda has done many attacks of international terror, notably the 9/11 attacks, but recently ISIS is taking a page out of their book and launching their own terrorism. And when it comes to the West, they are doing what al Qaeda has been doing all these years, which is recruiting Europeans and training them and sending them back -- Pamela?

BROWN: And as you said, they hate each other, but it is a scary thought if perhaps one day down the road they join forces of their common goal to the attack the West.

And, Paul, quickly, Sunday, President Obama said he wants to get to the bottom of some altered ISIS intelligence. Let's listen.

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BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: My expectation which is the highest fidelity to the facts, the data and the truth, and if there are disagreements in terms of how folks are interpreting the facts, then it should be reflected in the reports that we receive, that some folks think this is going on and others think that is going on and that is part of what I weigh in terms of making decisions.

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BROWN: That is a statement that comes out after some said ISIS was, quote, "contained," in Syria and Iraq. How concerning is this, Paul?

CRUICKSHANK: Very concerning. Indeed, the president of the United States needs to have full picture coming through to him. There were many in the U.S. military intelligence apparatus who are very skeptical of the containment. This is a group that is very entrenched in Iraq. They control Mosul, Ramadi and Raqqa. And you also have a terrorist state that is intolerable to the West. And the existence of the terrorist state on the Mediterranean shore is something that cannot be tolerated. Otherwise, you will see more days of these days like Friday in Paris play out. So there's increasingly calls in Europe and France for a much more robust approach against ISIS moving beyond just this strategy of air strikes and sort of the gradual degradation to a much more intense focus on removing this terrorist safe haven before you have these terrorist attacks -- Pamela?

[11:54:22] BROWN: Paul Cruickshank, thank you so much.

The video of a white Chicago police officer killing an -African American teenager is about to be public as Chicago gets set for a big wave of protests.

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BROWN: Chicago is gearing up for potential unrest this week. The city is set to release a dash cam video of a white police officer gunning down a black teenager. Top officials are calling for calm, but some are fired up.

CNN correspondent Ryan Young joins me from Chicago with the very latest -- Ryan?

RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Pamela, everybody is talking about the story, especially because the city fought to keep this video from being released. But the judge said that the video had to be released by Wednesday, and so there was a community meeting to talk about the ramifications of having the video out there. Everybody is bracing themselves for what could happen next.

BROWN: All right. Ryan Young, we will have to wait and see when that video is released. Do we have any idea for the timing of that?

YOUNG: We are told that the video has to be coming out before Wednesday, and we are told that as long as it is out before 12:00, it is fine. But, look, this is what we have been working for all weekend long, and using the time to talk the community that there is no reaction, and especially violence in the street. So we have been talking to the people who have been working with the community members to make sure they understand how violent it will be. The young man shot 16 times, and all of it caught on the dash cam video. And it is something that obviously people are bracing themselves for.

BROWN: Absolutely.

Ryan Young, thank you so much.

And thank you for joining AT THIS HOUR.

"Legal View" with Ashleigh Banfield starts right now.