Return to Transcripts main page

WOLF

Chicago Mayor Fires Police Chief; Trust In Police Department Has Eroded; U.S. Beefing Up Special Forces In Iraq And Syria; Special Forces in Iraq and Syria. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired December 1, 2015 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer. It's 1:00 p.m. here in Washington, 7:00 p.m. in Paris, 9:00 p.m. in Baghdad. Wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BLITZER: Lots of news happening today but let's get to the breaking news out of Chicago. First, the mayor there, Rahm Emanuel, has fired the city's police superintendent, Garry McCarthy. The move comes after a week of protests over the city's handling of a shooting of a black teenager, Laquan McDonald, by a white police officer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR RAHM EMANUEL (D), CHICAGO: After this weekend, after effectively handling both the protests that followed the release of the McDonald video last week and the arrest of Laquan's killer, superintendent McCarthy and I began a discussion on Sunday about the direction of the department and the undeniable fact that the public trust and the leadership of the department has been shaken and eroded.

This morning, I formally asked for his resignation. The superintendent Garry's record at the Chicago Police Department is a strong one and one that he can be proud of. I am grateful for his service to the city. He has both modernized the police department and brought real results for the people of the city of Chicago.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Public outrage erupted after police delayed the release of a dash cam video. I want to warn our viewers. It is very disturbing, disturbing that the captured -- that capture the police officer, Jason Van Dyke, fatally shooting the teenager, Laquan McDonald, 16 times. Police held onto the video for more than a year. The officer was in charge until the judge ordered that the video be made public. Ryan Young is joining us now from Chicago. Ryan, so, what's the immediate reaction to the breaking news, the mayor's sudden announcement that the police chief should be fired?

RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, we actually -- someone actually walked by our live sign and starting screaming yes and that's the reaction that we've seen from some people. Others are confused by this, just looking on Twitter because, obviously, Garry McCarthy is the superintendent here. But this is not an at-will police department. The superintendent can't just fire any office that he wants to.

In fact, he did strip him of his powers. He sat at that desk for 13 months, Jason Van Dyke, before getting that first degree murder charge. And, of course, he's out on bond after walking out of the jail last night. Look, a lot of people want to know why did it take 400 days for this video to be released? Who saw it and what happened? And they're also pointing to Anita Alvarez, wondering if they'll be changing there. I can honestly tell you when you woke up in the morning, this is the cover of the newspaper that was in town, in the "Sun Times," was saying Jerry McCarthy needed to be fired.

The superintendent then went on a media tour this morning, going to radio stations and police T.V. stations trying to say, look, he doesn't think he should be fired. He thinks he's doing the job that the mayor set out for him, and he thought the mayor had his back. All that has now changed. And, of course, there are questions about what will happen next in this city? Because there's obviously a large mistrust between the community and the police department.

You talk about the 16 shots to Laquan McDonald, two of which while he was standing, 14 on the ground. We saw those people march up Michigan Avenue on Black Friday chanting, 16 shots, 16 shots. Now, the fallout of this is like an onion, because people also want to know what will happen next to the city government? They want to know if the investigations here in the city will change, what tangible can they touch in terms of a timetable about what will happen next -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Ryan, thanks very much. Many have questioned whether the mayor has done enough in this case. Listen to this exchange between the mayor, Rahm Emanuel, and reporters just a little while ago.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Mayor, how do you build trust and transparency when it appears that the tapes have been tampered with? And are we ever going to get the truth about what happened to those -- what happened to the audio lines --

EMANUEL: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: -- (INAUDIBLE)?

EMANUEL: I think it goes, again, why I addressed the first part but let me repeat it or make this (INAUDIBLE) point. There are three elements to here. There was a civil settlement. There was a criminal investigation that's now charges that were brought. And there's an ongoing U.S. attorney-FBI investigation. Questions like that exist to the Burger King, the conduct at the -- at that point by the police department, other things that the police department took afterwards, all that will be -- is being looked at by the Justice Department.

And so, when you say that, I would just say, there are three separate distinct parts, one was civil, one was criminal and one is civil rights and otherwise. And they're all -- and when they conclude, a lot of what you are asking, totally legitimate, they will have the questions -- they will have the answers to those questions.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Mayor, (INAUDIBLE) distraction as well?

EMANUEL: Have I?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have you and your office become a distraction?

EMANUEL: I don't -- I'm responsible to the public to do the job of being a mayor. And you earn that trust every day.

[13:05:02] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you seen the video? Have you seen the video, Mr. Mayor?

EMANUEL: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And if you have seen it, --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Excuse me. Mr. McCarthy had become a distraction.

EMANUEL: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There are a lot of questions in this room about you and your office. HaveHH you become a distraction as well?

EMANUEL: Well, you'll make that judgment. I think I'm doing my job and I try to do it every day and do it in a professional way.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: All right, let's get some reaction from the alderman of the Chicago's Fifth District. Leslie Hairston is joining us on the phone. Leslie, thanks very much for joining us. I know you've been a vocal critic of the mayor and the superintendent. The police chief has now been fired. What's your reaction to the mayor's announcement?

LESLIE HAIRSTON, WARD ALDERMAN, CHICAGO'S FIFTH DISTRICT (via telephone): Well, the -- I have been calling for the superintendent's firing since October if not before. So, I'm glad to have seen this move forward.

BLITZER: Is it enough?

HAIRSTON: No, it's not enough. It's just the beginning. I mean, you've got a whole system that has failed in the Chicago Police Department, and we are going to have to fix that internal structure.

BLITZER: Do you have confidence in mayor Emanuel?

HAIRSTON: I do not have confidence in the mayor. What I am seeing now is more of the same. And you know if you keep doing more of the same and expecting different results, that doesn't happen.

BLITZER: As you know, he's appointed the accountability task force to take a look at the entire structure of the police in Chicago. Do you have confidence in that? Will that make a difference?

HAIRSTON: Well, that is the first action that he has taken that shows me that he is not serious about this, because some of the members that are appointed were part of the police review authority that allowed this to go on and that failed to make recommendations for policy changes in the police department which is what they are supposed to be doing.

BLITZER: So, what do you anticipate the reaction will be on the streets of Chicago to what's going on?

HAIRSTON: Well, I think the reactions will be people are going to continue to push for more transparency in the police department. I think we're just starting to see the beginning of a movement towards accountability.

BLITZER: Leslie Hairston, the Fifth ward alderman in Chicago. Thanks so much for joining us.

HAIRSTON: Thank you very much.

BLITZER: Let's get some more perspective on what's going on. Joining us is our CNN Law Enforcement Analyst, the former FBI assistant director, Tom Fuentes, who was a police officer before he joined the FBI just outside of Chicago. So, is this going to calm thing down? What do you think?

TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Actually, Wolf, I don't think it'll calm things down too much. I think there's still going to be a concern in the community of how things are conducted in Chicago. And I think that, you know, much of what the mayor said was contradictory even as to the decision-making. He said, well, we can't give you all the answers until all the investigations are over. Well, if they're not over, he's going ahead and firing the superintendent prematurely.

BLITZER: He praised the superintendent for doing an excellent job. But at the same time, he says that people have lost confidence in him.

FUENTES: Well, he's lost confidence in him for sure, if it's just the people or if it's, you know, other issues that come up. But, you know, this is a classic case of the superintendent is being held responsible but not all of this is his fault. The fact that it took 400 days for the state's attorney's office to bring the criminal charges against the officer. We don't know all the decision-making as to holding that video for the 400 days also. Then, the mayor says, well, I didn't want to look at the video. I didn't want to taint the investigation. Yet, they went ahead and settled with the family which basically is like saying, OK, the office was at fault. So, he's made many contradictory statements in the -- in the decision-making process all along in this thing.

BLITZER: What's the likely reaction among rank and file police officers in Chicago to what's going on?

FUENTES: I think the rank and file are going to think that superintendent McCarthy was sacrificed, that it's just a political thing, Rahm Emanuel deciding to get rid of him and appease protesters, appease the public or excitement of the public and just throw him out and bring somebody else in later that may be more politically acceptable.

BLITZER: Tom Fuentes, thanks very much.

Coming up, we'll have more on this story.

But also other breaking news happening right now, more American Special Forces getting ready to head to Iraq and Syria, bolstering the U.S. military's fight against ISIS. We'll have details of the mission and the decision behind it. We will go inside Syria right after a quick break.

[13:09:30]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: We have breaking news coming into CNN on the war against ISIS. More U.S. special operations' forces are now heading to Iraq and to Syria, part of what's being described as an expanding effort to defeat ISIS on the ground. The U.S. defense secretary, Ash Carter, and the Joint Chiefs of Staff chairman, General Joseph Dunford, announcing the decision earlier this morning during testimony before the House Armed Services Committee. Here is Secretary Carter just a little while ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ASH CARTER, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: In full coordination with the government of Iraq, we're deploying a specialized expeditionary targeting force to assist Iraqi and Kurdish Peshmerga forces and put even more pressure on ISIL. These special operators will, over time, be able to conduct raids, free hostages, gather intelligence and capture ISIL leaders. This force will also be in a position to conduct unilateral operations in Syria.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Let's go to our Pentagon Correspondent Barbara Starr. She's joining us from the Pentagon. Also joining us is Ben Wedeman. He's inside Syria right now.

Barbara, what do we know about these U.S. Special Forces who will be deployed to Syria right now? Because earlier, the president had authorized up to 50 special operation forces to go into northern Syria. How many more troops is Secretary Carter talking about?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, it could be a couple of hundred additional troops. But let me separate out a couple of things. About 50 Special Forces, exactly what you said, are scheduled to arrive in northern Syria at any time now. They are well on their way to getting there in the coming days.

[13:15:09] Those troops, those 50, will be to assist opposition forces in northern Syria in their fight against ISIS.

Separately, what Secretary Carter spoke about today is a brand new idea to try and show some forward progress on the fight against ISIS. Again, several dozen special operations forces, but plus their own backup, their own helicopters, their own surveillance, intelligence, their own search and rescue if they need it. So you're talking about a new element of perhaps upwards of 200 additional forces. They will operate out of a secure location in northern Iraq. The U.S. isn't saying exactly where. And they will be able to move very quickly either in northern Iraq or over into northern Syria to go after high- valued senior ISIS leadership, to gather intelligence, to stage raids.

One of the big things that they're trying to accomplish at the Pentagon is to increase their ability to get intelligence on ISIS. They feel they have made a lot of progress on that recently, but nothing really beats eyes and ears on the ground, and they hope these new troops will contribute to the effort.

Wolf.

BLITZER: So theoretically at least there could be not just 50 U.S. troops inside Syria. There could be as many at one time as 250 U.S. troops inside Syria, is that right?

STARR: Well, you're absolutely right, as you say, just now, theoretically. If there is a big enough target, if there is a big enough mission. They will base out of northern Iraq, but they will be very mobile, very rapid, we are led to believe, in their ability to get into northern Syria if that is what is needed.

Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, let me -- let's check in with Ben Wedeman. He's been inside Syria now. You've been there watching what's going on. You've spoke to some of those who are fighting ISIS inside Syria. What do they think? Will these additional U.S. troops make much of a difference?

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, certainly they welcome the possibility of the arrival of U.S. special forces. Now, they say they already have fairly good connections or communications with coalition forces. We were speaking to one commander today who say they -- who said -- told us they have very good coordination at the highest levels when it comes to calling in air strikes in the offensive against ISIS when you go to the front lines.

It's interesting, Wolf, because I spent a lot of time with the Iraqi army and other militias fighting ISIS in Iraq and what you saw there were a lot of deficiencies in terms of morale, in terms of leadership. Here, that doesn't seem to be the case. That they seem to have very high morale, men and women fighting on the front lines. What they're really looking for, what they would like to receive from the United States and its coalition partners is more and better weapons. They say they've received ammunition for -- like machine guns, for mortars and whatnot, but what they're looking for is heavier equipment, heavier weaponry that would be more effective because what we've seen certainly in some parts of northeastern Syria is that ISIS have been pushed back quite dramatically in those areas where the Kurdish and other force, anti-ISIS forces, have had good coordination with the air forces when it comes to the calling in air strikes. But they say what they need really is heavy weapons to fight ISIS.

Wolf.

BLITZER: Yes, and I'm sure they do.

All right, Ben, thanks very much. Ben Wedeman, be careful over there inside Syria.

Let's talk more about the developing U.S. strategy, and it is emerging right now. Joining us, Lieutenant General Mark Hertling, retired. He's a CNN military analyst, a former U.S. Army commanding general. Also joining us, Phil Mudd. He's our senior counterterrorism analyst, a former CIA counterterrorism official, and Paul Cruickshank, he's a CNN terrorism analyst.

So, first of all, General Hertling, what do you think these additional 200 special operations forces who will be based in northern Iraq but could move easily into Syria, joining these other 50 U.S. special operation forces, is it really going to make much of a difference?

LT. GEN. MARK HERTLING, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, I'm not going to put a number on it like Barbara just did, Wolf. But, yes, they certainly will. And, remember, this has been the plan from the very beginning. As -- as we've said a year ago, as the rebel forces and the Iraqi forces stood up, we would continue to contribute more and more to their capability. That's what's happening right now.

When you're talking about task organizing, which the Army does, the military does very well, special operations does it at the next higher level than the rest of the military, you're putting together a group on the ground, task-oriented for a specific mission to -- to accomplish a specific task. That's what's occurring right now, a group of individuals who can react very quickly, who can contribute to the fight on the ground, and who can help the indigenous forces in a means that they might not have had before.

[13:20:20] BLITZER: These are combat troops and it certainly sounds like combat boots on the ground, which, of course, the president has strongly resisted over these past several years.

Phil Mudd, the president had a news conference in Paris today, just before leaving to come back here to Washington, and he was very blunt, I thought, candid, in criticizing Turkey for keeping a huge part of its border with Syria open. Listen -- listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: There's about 98 kilometers that are still used as a transit point for foreign fighters. ISIL shipping out fuel for sale that helps finance their terrorist activities. And so we have been having our militaries work together to determine how a combination of air and Turkish ground forces on the Turkish side of the border can do a much better job of sealing the order than it currently is. And I think President Erdogan recognizes that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: He may recognize that, but Turkey, as you know, is a NATO ally. It has a huge military. And the president says 98 kilometers of that border is open, not just for terrorists to move back and forward easily, but also for ISIS to ship oil from Syria, from Iraq, Syria, into Turkey, to make money, to fund additional terror operation. The president saying all of this. That's a pretty damning indictment of Turkey.

PHIL MUDD, CNN SENIOR COUNTERTERRORISM ANALYST: The damning indictment is not just about the border, Wolf. We have just in a week or so after the Turks downing a Russian aircraft, the head of NATO, or one of the heads of NATO, as the president of the United States, calling out the Turks publicly. This goes back to the beginning of the Turks' involvement in this campaign. They said they were engaged in the bombing campaign. Most of their bombing has been against Kurdish rebels, not against ISIS. They said they would close the border. That's not working out that well. And then they embarrassed NATO by that downing of the aircraft. I think it's the president not just talking about the border, but publically sending a message to President Erdogan in Turkey, and that is, you guys better cooperate further and get in line with NATO or else we're going to call you out, as he did today.

BLITZER: Because the suggestion is, and others have made this accusation against Turkey, the Russians have certainly made it, Putin have made it, that Turkey's making money actually taking in ISIS oil coming into Turkey and reselling it on the black market. Paul Cruickshank, that's a very, very tough charge against Turkey.

PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: I think the evidence suggest that there's some trade through middlemen and that some of the oil is ending up perhaps in Turkish hands.

BLITZER: But if Turkey wanted to close that 98-kilometer chunk of that border, they easily have the manpower to do it.

CRUICKSHANK: They easily have manpower. They have one of the largest standing armies. ISIS just hasn't been the priority for Erdogan, for Turkey. Their focus has been on the PKK, the Kurds, as Phil was saying. Their whole security establishment is hardwired to deal with the PKK threat and so they haven't been doing enough to confront ISIS on the border and they haven't been doing enough to confront ISIS inside Turkey as well.

And ISIS has a growing safe haven inside Turkey, inside Turkish cities like Istanbul. They have a network of safe houses, supporters, fundraisers, people organizing for people to take trips into Syria. And increasingly we're seeing evidence of ISIS orchestrating terrorist plots against Europe from Turkey itself. These recruits going into Turkey, meeting with ISIS operatives there, not even needing to go to Syria anymore, Wolf.

BLITZER: Were you surprised, General Hertling, by the president's blunt criticism of Turkey, a NATO ally, for, in effect, in effect cooperating with ISIS?

HERTLING: I was not, Wolf. In fact, I think this has been a long time coming. Turkey has improved by degrees along their border, but not significantly. And as -- as Paul just said, there have been those rat lines going through Turkey. They've been going through for the last several year. And whereas Turkey has shown the appearance of attempting to crack down on them, they haven't done a very good job.

The intel sharing that we talk about when we're talking about getting information to other countries in Europe all emanates from Turkey and they have not been all that good in sharing intelligence and information on radical extremists in their country. So, yes, I think the president has attempted to be nuanced about this, and today's statement was probably a lot more avert than anything he's said in the past.

BLITZER: Yes, it certainly sounds like his frustration. Obviously, he's trying to be diplomatic. He had just met with President Erdogan. But when he says, the president, ISIS -- ISIL, in his word, shipping out fuel for sale to helps finance their terrorist activities, Phil, that's a pretty strong statement from the president that Turkey, a NATO ally, is in effect making money helping ISIS.

[13:25:16] MUDD: That is I think what the Turks hoped when they shot down that aircraft and called for a NATO meeting is that they would get broader NATO support for something that put NATO in a very difficult position as Putin digs in his heels in Syria. I think what has happened is just the reverse, and we saw that from the president today.

Far from trying to get NATO to side with Turkey in a battle against -- at least a diplomatic battle against the Russians, the Turks are realizing that if they don't line up, everybody from the Germans, the French, the Brits is going to come saying, line up with NATO privately or else we're going to come out publicly and hammer you.

BLITZER: And now the Russians have installed in Latakia (ph) this surface to air missile battery which potentially could affect Turkish warplanes and F-16s, but a lot of U.S. planes are flying in that area. There could be a miscalculation and this could trigger even greater escalation.

CRUICKSHANK: Absolutely right, a lot of concern about what happens next, as you say, Wolf.

BLITZER: A lot of concern indeed. All right, guys, thanks very much. We're staying on top of this story. Up next, the chairman of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff says the U.S. strategy is, in fact, working, and he's not afraid to ask for more U.S. troops on the ground, combat boots on the ground, not only in Iraq but in Syria now. One member of the House Armed Services Committee will join us live right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)