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AT THIS HOUR WITH BERMAN AND MICHAELA
Legendary British Singer David Bowie Dies; Mexican Actress Linked to Penn-Guzman Interview; News Polls in Presidential Race. Aired 11:30a-12p ET
Aired January 11, 2016 - 11:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[11:30:00] DONNA BRAZILE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: That's the debate you'll hear this week with Democrats after the State of the Union because we have to hear from the president first.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: That's tomorrow night.
Donna Brazile, Bruce Haynes, thanks so much.
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks, guys.
BRUCE HAYNES, REPUBLICAN CONSULTANT & CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Go Tigers tonight.
BOLDUAN: Just a reminder, any moment Donald Trump will start taking questions, we're told, live -- at this live town hall. We'll listen in. We'll take you back there when he makes news. We'll see.
BERMAN: Plus, it was a tough morning for a lot of people waking up to the news that David Bowie had passed away. A rock legend dying after a secret battle with cancer. The story behind Bowie's final album released just a few days ago.
And stunning new video just in of the raid that took down one of the world's most-wanted men. Inside el Chapo's secret hideout and what happened just before his capture.
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BOLDUAN: Everyone remembering, thinking back to their favorite Bowie songs. It's a shocking headline to wake up to. David Bowie dead at 69 after a battle with cancer. News of his illness came as a surprise to many. A post on his Facebook page said that he had passed away surrounded by his family. BERMAN: Truly one of the all-time greats, a visionary writer,
musician, performer. And with every success -- you saw it on the screen there -- came reinvention. Nearly 50 years in the business and he was still creating right up until the end. His final album released Friday. He collaborated in an off-Broadway musical as well.
I want to talk about David Bowie and the contribution he made.
Joining us now, film critic, writer, columnist, Kurt Loder, also a long-time editor at "Rolling Stone."
You talked to David Bowie many times.
KURT LODER, FILM CRITIC, WRITER & COLUMNIST & FORMER EDITOR, ROLLING STONE MAGAZINE: We interacted over the years many times. He's a very interesting guy, very intelligent and very, very consumed with music. He knew the history of music really well. And music was his life. His enthusiasm for it and his authenticity was really moving. A cheerful guy, loved art, loved movies.
BERMAN: We talk about all the changes he made. We talk about all the songs he made. Was he aware of his role, his sort of position in our culture?
LODER: I'm sure he was aware to it, right down to the ground. He was aware of media. He used media really well. We remember all the various guises he went through and how he changed things around as a culture. But I think the basic thing about him was he wrote great songs, made great records. Had 27 albums over the course of 50 years. The remarkable thing about them is how remarkable so many of them were. They are classics.
BOLDUAN: You talk about he was good at writing music, making music, but he also had -- a lot of people talk after folks pass about their impact on their industry and culture, but he really did. He changed things.
LODER: He really did. Starting with the glam rock thing, moving up through sort of taking the euro synthesizer thing, blending it with punk. The really interesting thing about him, I think, everybody misses someone whose music they grow up with, but David Bowie wasn't a relic of an earlier era. He released one of his most probing records three days ago. It is one of the most experimental albums he's ever done. The opening track "Blackstar" is just astonishing.
BERMAN: I have to admit I have not had a chance to listen to it, but so many people are talking about it. When you hear this new album that he wrote, you know, at 68 years old, because his birthday was Friday also, do you hear in the album the knowledge from David Bowie that he knew he was about to die?
LODER: You get the feeling, I think, from the second video he did. It starts out with him in a hospital bed. You sort of get -- for the past 12 years since he had a heart attack on stage at a festival in Germany, and he never performed again, you knew something was going on. He strictly did music. And I think for this album he just stopped into a jazz club in New York one night, saw some guys playing, some really known jazz guys, and said, let's make this record and brought them in. He's very open to experimentation and I assume he's always writing.
BERMAN: What do you miss most?
LODER: What do I miss most?
BERMAN: What will you miss most?
LODER: Fortunately, he left all the records behind. All the music is still here. He's gone. It's a shame that we won't see new things. He was still doing new things but all the great things are still here.
BERMAN: Kurt Loder, thanks for coming in.
BOLDUAN: Thank you.
BERMAN: It's great to talk to someone who actually spent time with David Bowie and got to know him firsthand. Appreciate it.
BOLDUAN: Thank you.
Coming up, could Sean Penn face legal trouble? That's the key question for a secret meeting for one of the world's most-wanted fugitives. We have new video in of what el Chapo told the actor before that drug lord's capture. We'll be right back.
[11:43:14] BERMAN: Just into CNN, newly released video of the deadly raid on the world's most-wanted man, Joaquin "el Chapo" Guzman.
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BERMAN: Five people were killed during this raid. One Marine was wounded. The Mexican navy arrested el Chapo during the raid on home turf, you know, where he lived early Friday.
Months before el Chapo's recapture, a really big interview took place in the Mexican jungle between Guzman and Actor Sean Penn, which may be connected somehow to his capture. After years of planning, Penn secured a confidential meeting to write a full-length article for "Rolling Stone." "Rolling Stone" also obtained a two-minute video believed to be Guzman's first recorded interview in decades.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
JOAQUIN "EL CHAPO" GUZMAN, MEXICAN DRUG KINGPIN: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
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BOLDUAN: So Penn's meeting was made by a possible connection, this Mexican actress, Kate Del Castillo. Now as Mexican authorities begin the extradition process for the drug lord, they want to question both actors.
Let's talk about this and more with the documentary filmmaker and director of "Drug Lord: The Legend of Short," Angus McQueen.
Angus, thank you for coming back.
The last time we spoke is when they were searching for el Chapo after his latest escape from a maximum security prison there. You spent, I think it was about four years -- about four years ago, you spent time looking for el Chapo. That was your documentary. Are you surprised now that they've captured him once and for all, maybe?
[11:45:13] ANGUS MCQUEEN, DOCUMENTARY FILMMAKER & DIRECTOR: Not at all. I think the humiliation of the most recent escape where the president of Mexico had to stand in Paris and explain to the world how this most-wanted man escaped under his shower, down a mile-long tunnel was so ludicrous that Mexican authorities had to go after him seriously this time. I think my big surprise is that he was taken alive, actually but -- because he's got so many secrets to tell, if he does get extradited.
BERMAN: So, you spent a long time studying this man. Now we have this piece written by Sean Penn and this video interview of el Chapo speaking. You know, what surprised you in reading this and seeing this? Is this the el Chapo you thought you knew?
MCQUEEN: Oh, absolutely. Very, very little of the article surprised me. Some of the tone of the article may have surprised me but, you know, I'll be honest, up front, I was very jealous and wished I was a Hollywood star and could have charmed Chapo on to camera. Our member of our team did meet him. He on three occasions agreed to give us an interview, but we failed. We never got him on camera. But we did find him. So, none of the Sean Penn particularly surprised me except for the actual fact it happened.
BOLDUAN: And, Angus, real quick, one final question, there's a big question, if this meeting, if Sean Penn basically led authorities to somehow to his capture, do you think it's connected?
MCQUEEN: I think there's a lot of froth about this. The point of the film I made was that anyone could find him because everybody knew where he was. The Mexican authorities basically knew where el Chapo was the whole time. And over the past few months, they've roughly known. And from evidence we have on the ground there, they've been putting huge pressure on him and the people who protect him over a number of months. I think there's a great bit of froth about blaming Sean Penn and Kate Del Castillo. I think they knew roughly where he was. And it may have helped, you know, in minor levels. But when they really wanted him, they could go and find him. BOLDUAN: Fascinating.
Angus McQueen, great to see you again. Thanks so much.
MCQUEEN: It's a pleasure.
BOLDUAN: Thank you.
Right now, the hunt is on for a missing suspect in a horrifying crime. Police in New York City are now searching for one of five teenagers accused of raping a girl at gunpoint after threatening her father. This all happened at a playground. New details are just in. We'll be right back.
[11:52:20] BERMAN: Into the fray. And you are looking at live pictures of Donald Trump on the left in New Hampshire and Bernie Sanders on the right in Iowa. Three weeks to go until actual votes cast in the 2016 race, and two of the leading candidates out there on the stumps leading the crowds.
BOLDUAN: And as new polls are coming out with some important messages to the candidates in the final weeks.
Let's discuss and bring in from Washington, A.B. Stoddard, the associate editor, of "The Hill."
A.B., it's great to see you.
Donald Trump today hitting on his high points, talking about the polls, the ones he like likes, and also, Ted Cruz and hitting on Hillary Clinton, and not hitting on Hillary Clinton. Not hitting on Hillary Clinton, let me make that clear, but talking about Hillary Clinton. We're three weeks out. Is this what we are going to be seeing here, more of Donald Trump, three weeks to Iowa, or what do you expect here in the final sprint?
A.B. STODDARD, ASSOCIATE EDITOR, THE HILL: Well, it is really interesting that he has been sort of focused on the Clintons while everybody else in the polls underneath him have been ratcheting up the criticism of each other. I thought that today was a little bit of the subdued crowd for things that Donald Trump is saying. He is actually turning up the heat with what he said about Hillary married to the abuser. Today he said the FBI should go after her, please, so I can run against Bernie. He has not asked to run against Bernie before. And he said that Ted Cruz copied the immigration plan. And he is going harder, quoting Laurence Tribe (ph) on the birthplace issue against Ted Cruz. And then he did his trademark incoherent rant about Macy's, the "Union Leader," and "Time" magazine, his Twitter followers, his love of fire marshals and all of that stuff that the crowd didn't seem so enthused about. But it was an interesting moment where I see him planting some more flags and trying to -- I think that he is worried about Bernie in New Hampshire, and that is an open primary where there are Independents there called undeclareds who can vote in either primary. And so the Bernie excitement is making him worried. They probably share some supporters or groups -- universes of supporter, and worried about what can happen to turn the numbers in the next three weeks.
BERMAN: Interesting idea. And now let's talk Iowa, with Bernie Sanders within spitting distance of Hillary Clinton, and three points back in the most recent poll. And the Clinton campaign wants Iowa badly, and they have been organizing it for a long, long time, and what are they doing over the next three weeks to try to fend Bernie off?
STODDARD: Well, I think she has made it clear she going to be taking the gun issue, which is popular with the Democratic base, and obviously, president Clinton -- excuse me, President Obama, Freudian slip, and one of the remaining days in office and I think she'll hit it hard. That is a message that is going to be working with the Democratic primary voters, and maybe it is not going help her win Iowa, but it is what has over with Bernie Sanders there. I think there's going to be a lot of talk about that. And she is going to be hitting the electability thing, because although you see those numbers where he seems to be polling better in the general election matchups, it is a far distance to Election Day. And he is pretty much a new candidate, and he has not gone through the national presidential campaign grinder, so she believes that she can convince the primary voters that in the end she is more likable than a Socialist.
[11:55:47] BOLDUAN: A.B. Stoddard. Great to see you, A.B.
STODDARD: Thank you.
BOLDUAN: Thank you.
And we have more on the new video of a raid that took down one of the world's most-wanted men. Inside el Chapo's secret hideout, and what happened just before his capture. We will be right back.