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CNN LIVE EVENT/SPECIAL
Cruz, Trump Tie For Wins, Sanders Beats Clinton; Trump Gets Close Wins in Kentucky, Louisiana; CNN Series Explores Heated Moments of Campaigns Past. Aired 1-2a ET
Aired March 6, 2016 - 01:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[01:00:00] SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT), DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Democracy is not about its billionaires buying elections.
HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: This country belongs to all of us, and not just those at the top.
SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R-FL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And the map only gets friendly for us after tonight. We knew it would be the roughest part of the campaign.
GOV. JOHN KASICH (R-OH), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The spirit of our country is the lower, because we don't like what is happening in Washington.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm John Berman and we are live and we want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and all around the world.
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Kate Bolduan. Thanks so much for joining us. You are watching continuing special coverage of Super Saturday, and guess what, we're into Super Sunday now. Super for some and a little less super for others. The two frontrunners Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton finishing the night still in the lead with the overall delegate math, but now without seeing some big losses tonight.
BERMAN: Let's look at the races right now. A Democrat aside Bernie Sanders took Nebraska and Kansas, and took them big. And Hillary Clinton took Louisiana by a large margin.
BERMAN: Along the Republican lines right now. Ted Cruz, he had big victories in Kansas and Maine, and Donald Trump won the two biggest states Kentucky and Louisiana, but it was really close in those states. Let's look at the delegate math right now. Hillary Clinton with the lead, 1,131 to Bernie Sanders, 479 and because all of you will ask me, yes, we do include Super delegates. On the Republican side. Donald Trump maintains his lead. He's at 385. Ted Cruz 298. Marco Rubio way back right now at 126. And again, we should know note that Ted Cruz did win more delegates tonight. So Donald Trump held a news conference tonight. And he said, Marco Rubio should flat out, drop out. He also has some choice words for Ted Cruz. Listen to him and listen to what the other candidates said tonight.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I want to congratulate Ted on Maine and on Kansas, and he should do well in Maine, because it is very close to Canada. Let's face it. Marco Rubio had a very, very bad night. And personally, I'd call for him to drop out of the race. I think it is time now that he drop out of the race. I really think so. I would love to take on Ted one on one, and that would be so much fun, because Ted can't win New York, he can't win New Jersey, he can't win Pennsylvania, he can't win California, I want Ted one-on-one, OK.
SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We are seeing men and women all across this country who are fed up with Washington, fed up with politicians who don't tell them the truth. Coming together and saying enough is enough.
RUBIO: Here's the bottom-line. There is going to be more delegates awarded in Florida than basically every state that voted tonight combined because it is winner take all states. The states that voted tonight are important, we're going to leave tonight with more delegates than we had yesterday. I have explained repeatedly, that this is a proportional process and every night that we have caucuses like there were tonight in three states, we continue to pick up delegates.
SANDERS: If you are going to be paid $225,000 for speech, it must be a fantastic speech. A brilliant speech. Which you would want to share with the American people, right? OK.
CLINTON: Today, Democrats, caucused and voted in Louisiana, Kansas and Nebraska. I want to congratulate Senator Sanders for running a strong campaign, and I'm thrilled that we are adding to our pledge delegate count and I'm grateful to everyone who turned out to support us, but now all eyes turn to Michigan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: All right, you just heard from every candidate still in the race except for John Kasich by the way.
BOLDUAN: He is still in the race.
BERMAN: He is still in the race. And he did finish ahead of Marco Rubio, and at least one stay, he stayed in through Ohio no matter what. Let's look about the state of the race right now.
Joining us, CNN political reporter Tal Kopan. Tal, your big takeaways from the Republican side, doesn't maybe change the state of the race, but Ted Cruz did win more delegates tonight.
TAL KOPAN, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Absolutely. It's funny, in some ways it is the exact same race as it was going into day, and in some ways it's completely different. You know, there's no doubt that this is a big night for Ted Cruz. He really, not only that he did win two states and Donald Trump on two states, but Ted Cruz really won those two states. I mean, it was a resounding victory and it was shockingly close compared to some of what we had seen going into the race, in the two states he narrowly lost to the Donald Trump, and that is a big show of strength. While we probably didn't see any momentum swings mathematically tonight, you know, Ted Cruz is still behind by about 100, and there is a lot of proportional races left, and Marco Rubio is still trailing. I think we saw some big changes in momentum tonight especially for Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio.
BOLDUAN: And Tal, looking at the Democrats specially heading into tomorrow night's very important CNN debate in Flint, Michigan, as Hillary Clinton said, all the focuses now in Michigan, you can be sure that is very, very true. What is tonight mean for tomorrow?
[01:05:10] KOPAN: You know, I think that the race changed a little bit less on the Democratic side, even though Bernie Sanders beat Hillary Clinton in two states and she only beat him in one. In the end, they're probably going to have a pretty similar delegate haul coming out of today, and she is far ahead when you include the Super delegates, but she is also pretty far ahead when you're just looking at the pledge delegates, she is definitely the frontrunner. And we're seeing Bernie Sanders' transform a little bit, his message is becoming a little bit more simply focused on policies and not necessarily about winning, it's about getting his message out there. In the debate, I think we're going to see him really drive home his themes, really try to pin her into some corners on where she stands on his most important issues, but he is mostly chipping away here, he is not necessarily making the argument that he is still going to be come from behind and upset her overall.
BERMAN: All right. Tal Kopan, thanks so much for being with us.
We want to bring in our panel right now. Senior politics editor of "The Daily Beast" Jackie Kucinich, CNN political analyst and Editor- in-chief of "The Daily Beast" John Avalon. Political strategist --
ANGELA RYE, POLITICAL STRATEGIST: You say it like you don't even believe it.
BERMAN: I know. He's got a big job. He is a big important guy. And former executive director of the Congressional Black Caucus Angela Rye. Also with us, CNN political commentator and Donald Trump's supporter Kayleigh McEnany. And CNN political commentator and contributor for The Atlantic Peter Beinart. Jackie, you have had a break. You've been in the back room --
JACKIE KUCINICH, SENIOR POLITICS EDITOR, "THE DAILY BEAST": Yes.
BOLDUAN: So, you are fresh.
BERMAN: Although, you were writing, you're working on your lead story I think for "The Daily Beast" tomorrow, what is the big story tonight on the Republican side?
KUCINICH: Well, Ted Cruz's big win as Tal mentioned and also the fact that the GOP establishment just needs a drink and a hug at this point. It was a really tough night for them, because Marco Rubio is sort of been their standard bearer officially you are not. And he could not get it together. He came in third in most of the states, and no matter what, I know he is saying, you know, Florida is the Promised Land, but he is going in there with almost no momentum. So, you know, Tuesday, March 8th will be a day that he can maybe make up some of this --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Or a day that is brutal for him.
KUCINICH: Exactly. Or it could be another very bad day.
PETER BEINART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: And the irony I think for him here which is that he is going to be trying to wrap up a big vote in South Florida among the Cubans and also in South and Central Florida among Puerto Ricans, right? But he has tacked so far to the right on the immigration issues in this campaign, that you wonder now whether actually it's going to be hard for him to go back to the Latino base, and so he was speaking Spanish at the end of the last day of voting now, how much juice does he still have there? Can he get the vote that he needs?
KAYLEIGH MCENANY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: It's worth pointing out, you know, I am a Floridian. I hear this all the time. Floridians are angry with Marco Rubio, because he was right on immigration before he was standing with Chuck Schumer and really violated the trust of the voters who put him there. He said one thing when he campaign and said he was against amnesty, goes to the Senate. He's for amnesty. Florida voters are also upset that he didn't show up to vote on the omnibus bill. That was a huge deal. They're very angry. They think they have a senator that hasn't done their job, it's something I hear constantly. He of course has large support in Southern Florida, that may sure up. But Florida voters are angry, and that should not be neglected.
BOLDUAN: And also obviously it should be noted that this Floridian is a very big Donald Trump supporter as well.
MCENANY: Yes. I am. That is worth noting.
BOLDUAN: On the democratic side, the sound bite that we heard from Bernie Sanders I think is the kind of the sound bite tonight when you are looking forward as to what this race looks like now for Democrats. He is sharpening ever so slightly sharpening his message against Hillary Clinton on the paid speeches, Angela. And the fact that has not released the transcripts of those paid speeches for Goldman. But still, I mean, sharpening his message or not, she is still winning big. She is still very much the frontrunner, what does he, what do you want to see him do? What do you want to see him change?
RYE: So, I think that several things, when we talked about it a little bit earlier. So you are talking about Bernie Sanders' sound bite was the line of the night or the line of the night for what the Democratic race will look like going forward. Of course, we saw Hillary's speech and it sounded like, what he talking points, what her message would be for the race going forward. BOLDUAN: Uh-hm.
RYE: She talked about making America whole again. She talked about trying to find love and kindness in this space in our body politics.
BOLDUAN: So you think she is turning to the general?
RYE: Well, and I am trying to figure out if Bernie Sanders is in it for the long haul, and he said at least until June 7th. He is in it for to win it, really shouldn't he be doing the same thing? Of course we know that it goes very well. It plays very well with the audience about the speeches --
RYE: But it also seems really clear that she has no intentions of releasing any transcripts until the rest of the candidate do that.
BERMAN: You know, the delegate math is tough for Bernie Sanders. The demographics are tough for Bernie Sanders, but John, he is winning states. He is winning states and he is collecting cash. And as long as you are winning states and collecting cash, why would you -- why would you drop out?
JOHN AVALON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Especially if you are running to make a point and to try to move the party on the policy. And look, which he is.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And she's move the conversation for sure.
AVALON: Yes, absolutely, and look, you know, first of all, I think both Ted Cruz and Bernie Sanders do well in the caucus states, that's not a surprise, right? To get a smaller cohort, usually close and you're going to have the most intense activist class show up. And so, that's a commonality. But there's an interesting commonality between actually Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders. Although they are opposite in almost everything, part of their core populist message is been that the system is rigged impart because of the big money, and you can focus on the, you know, questionable authenticity of a billionaire populist carrying that message or someone who is a lifelong democratic socialist, former mayor of Burlington, you can argue with --
[01:10:35] BERMAN: It is just like all of us. Right? Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump for --
BOLDUAN: Quoting from the magazine.
BERMAN: But not for nothing. Something that I think that tapped into that other candidates need to understand is a deep sense that the system is rigged by big money, and special interests, and they both sound that note and it really resonates.
MCENANY: And on trade, it's worth pointing out. I couldn't agree with you more, John. You know, the fact is real family income, and the bottom half of the income distribution has not gone up since 1960. That is something that Donald Trump taps into with the populist message of free trade, it's something Bernie Sanders tapped into and really both of their campaigns are fueled by this frustration and people who feel like they've been left behind in the lower half of the income distribution.
BEINART: And one of this fascinating questions coming out of this campaign for the Republican Party. How much can a Republican Party remain a pro-free trade party? You've seen it. The Democrats have hemorrhaged on that. But what Donald Trump has exposed is that the base of the Republican Party is no more supportive of these Craig deals than the base of the Democratic Party, and to the degree that those people move into the Republican Party and become a larger presence, it is going to be harder and harder for the Republican Party to continue to continue to support these trade deals.
BOLDUAN: That is the new base though, Peter.
BEINART: That is the new base.
BOLDUAN: Donald Trump had two very clear messages when he was speaking this evening. He said I would love to take Ted Cruz one on one. And he said very clearly multiple times. Marco Rubio needed to get out. What do you think? Does he have ulterior motives in saying that?
MCENANY: I kind of think it is reverse psychology, because if you're doing so well, why would you want to change something and get someone out of the race. And if you look at polling, it shows that Marco Rubio's supporters actually more go to Cruz than go to Trump. So, I just don't think you want to shake up the status core there.
KUCINICH: And another thing you're not really caring a lot of about is the fact that the base feels lied to about health care. During the 2014 race, you heard people like Reince Priebus the Republican establishment saying, we will going to repeal ObamaCare and don't you worry about it, and they didn't. Now, let's have aside and view, it's kind of impossible. Obama was not going to say, OK, and like sign a repeal of the bill.
KUCINICH: That wasn't going to happen. They did not have a veto- proof majority. But the fact that they made these promises and cannot deliver, the base has not forgotten.
AVALON: About Trump kind of trolling Marco on, you know, getting out of the race, I think sometimes one of the mistakes we make in watching these things so closely is we assume strategy, when really some matter of instinct. And we can go down the rabbit hole about whether he really wants a Cruz race who is trying to go Trump, Rubio --
BOLDUAN: He maybe just thought it and said it.
AVALON: Right. And I think that's usually in campaigns actually the more accurate thing. I think this really was an attempt to humiliate him and shove him into a locker. This is high school psychology of bullying rather than any grand master plan about field -- campaign.
BERMAN: Jackie, you know, Ted Cruz, the Cruz campaign are getting emails from all sorts of people connected to Ted Cruz. They say they are going to Florida to win, but they are also saying, by competing in Florida, you know, it sticks it to Marco Rubio.
KUCINICH: Well, yes, and that's what they want to do. They want to keep this narrative. That is a two-man race. Ted Cruz and Donald Trump and that's it. So, if they can pull just a couple of votes for Marco Rubio and make it so Trump beats him, at the end of the day, all the better for Ted Cruz. It's almost that are for Ted Cruz than it is for Donald Trump.
BEINART: It has made a fascinating question which is, you know, we have had this never Trump movement, right? And the question is, how does that never Trump movement go forward if the clear alternative to Trump is Cruz a guy who a lot of people in the Washington establishment hate as much if not even more, and does it start to fracture?
BERMAN: But there are different aspects and --
BEINART: Right. Right.
BERMAN: Which is a big part where a lot of the energy is.
BOLDUAN: They are very happy to have --
KUCINICH: And a lot of the candidates, I think Marco Rubio in particular missed a big moment the other night at the debate when each candidate had to answer whether or not they would vote for the Republican frontrunner. And each of them said, yes, but it was particularly awkward I felt like for Marco Rubio who really has sort of been the face, I mean, a swag on his website, that are #NeverTrump. And then he said, no, no, I was talking about in the primary. Oh, what do you -- what?
BERMAN: He is a conman, but I vote for him. He's a conman but if I have to, I will vote for him.
AVALON: And Kasich lost that, too. And look, I mean, you know, if they go to their brokered convention fantasy and Cruz and Trump are the overwhelming favorites, how does an option not named Cruz or Trump come out of that? And so, the center right is left homeless yet again. For some folks, that will be a choice between, you know, getting shot or taking poison.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Ouch.
AVALON: And it does speak to the fact that the center right lane is increasingly homeless in this Republican Party.
BERMAN: For the first time. For the first time. Because a center right has always been the nominee.
AVALON: They are the people who has the best chance of winning in general elections.
[01:15:01] BOLDUAN: Stand by guys. OK. So, Super Saturday is over. It is time to look forward to Super Sunday and beyond.
BERMAN: Salacious Sunday.
BOLDUAN: Oh, sorry. Screw that up again. We're going to be looking forward and we're also going to talk about tone, friends, the tone --
BOLDUAN: Salacious tone and behavior at some of these rallies, and we are talking about you Donald Trump and some of the -- and what is been happening at the Trump rallies, so he was asked about it tonight and you will hear what he said. We'll be right back.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[01:19:31] TRUMP: When you have that many people, you understand, in a room, and you'll have a couple of not skirmishes, just a couple of protests, really not skirmishes. And we treat them very gently, and ten years ago they would have been treated differently, not by me, but by the way that life is, we treat them very, very gently.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: All right. That is Donald Trump there saying he treats the people at his events very, very gently. Let's bring back our panel back and discuss if that is really the case.
Peter Beinart, how gentle the Donald Trump rally. Look, you wrote a piece about the tone right now. It's amazing.
BEINART: Well, it's very easy. Because actually that line he said about how in the past they used to treat them gently, he used a different version of that line a few weeks ago where he says, I love how they did it in the past, they would have had to take you out on a stretcher. So he has been much, much harsher when speaking to his own people. He's talked about how somebody in Atlanta should have gotten punched in the face. Here's the danger. We have a collegian here between an activist left in the Black Lives Matter movement and also coming out of the pro-immigration movement.
Doing a kind of direct action we've not seen in American politics in recent times. They are not cowed. These are very brave young people. They are not cowed by going into the middle of these rallies and what you will see is a ferocious, sometimes racist response by the Trump supporters, and we saw this in George Wallace. He played on the crowd for to get his guys riled up, but George Wallace never won a nomination. So we have never seen what happens when this goes forward into the summer and the fall.
BERMAN: He ran, in '68, he ran through though, right? And he won states.
BEINART: Right. Right. Right. Right. But he didn't have a major party -- so I think we're going to have hundreds more potential Trump rallies, and I think there is the danger of real violence.
BOLDUAN: Kayleigh, what do you think of what you see at these rallies? Because it has gotten to the point -- he's gotten to the point where our reporter, Jim Acosta one of our great correspondents had to ask Donald Trump about it. I mean, his rallies and what happens in them is very different than what we've seen in other rallies, what do you think about of the tone --
MCENANY: Well, Donald Trump is drawing protesters like no other candidate is. Today, his speech has interrupted 13 times, he could hardly get a few words out without an interruption. And I think it's very difficult when you are on a stage and you're looking at 35,000 people or today, 20,000 I supposed to what some of the other candidates are looking at to see what is going on. So, today, gracefully, I said, 13 times, get them out. And I think that that is what he needs to continue doing and that he can't help the people who show up at his rallies, other candidates are not getting these things sort of protests and he is handling it very well.
KUCINICH: I think now the first time that our candidates have been protested, you know, as the other rallies --
MCENANY: To this extent?
KUCINICH: No, I disagree. Because --
MCENANY: Thirteen times?
KUCINICH: Because I have been to so many Mitt Romney rallies because I covered that campaign last cycle. And there were rallies like that. And you know what the crowd did? They chanted USA, USA, and the security removed them. There was not the engagement, there wasn't the get them out of there, there was -- so maybe like a cutesy line like, oh, they're upset, I'm upset, too. Or something like that. It was not this kind of vitriol, it wasn't aging on the crowd, and that's very different. I have never seen anything like this.
RYE: Peter brought up Black Lives Matter, and I wanted to say that they started at Bernie Sanders' rallies and Hillary Clinton rallies and what is really bothering me to my core is not the actual protesters. I'm thinking about the Black woman who was just in the rally in Louisville, Kentucky and was physically pushed by several white men. One of them was a guy who was on its way to the advanced program for the marines who has since been kicked out of that program. You also have the students from Valdosta College who were crying, because they got -- they weren't protesting, they were just Black. MCENANY: And the one woman who was pushed -- should have never been
push, there is no excusing that, absolutely. But here is the thing. Just because one of your supporters does something egregious, it is not a reflection on you --
Just because of Black Panthers sort of that polling boast to bully people during when Obama was running -- that's not a reflection on Obama. You can't help the people --
RYE: So, I hope that you just didn't make that connection, Kayleigh.
MCENANY: You absolutely --
RYE: No, you can't. Because Donald Trump has been egging his supporters on to do this. They get a call at the beginning or a rallying call at the beginning of every rally --
RYE: Let me finish. Because they actually tell them beforehand how to handle the protesters. There was a Muslim woman who was spat upon walking out, just because she had on hijab. Like you have to understand that that this is a real problem and a very dangerous, and your candidate has to tone down some of this rhetoric.
BEINART: And he said, that guy should have been punched. He said, it was great when they used to take people out on stretchers. In Vermont, he said, don't give them their coats back on a freezing night, he has repeatedly egged on these people in his rallies.
[01:24:04] BERMAN: Yes. And couldn't he say, couldn't he say, if he wanted to, you know, from the stage, tone it down, guys. You know, I don't know that the answer is tone down his rhetoric in terms of what he is proposing or not, proposing to the contrary but should he say to the people in the crowd, you know what? Don't go after these protesters.
MCENANY: I think he is doing just fine by saying, get them out. I agree with you that I don't like the punch you in the face statement, perhaps he shouldn't say that. He has changed since he said that statement. And I think that is a good thing. However, I just simply saying, get them out, and having that as your go-to line and saying it 13 time is effective and what he needs to do.
RYE: But get them out, and what about the kids that are standing there and there was just black at their school? They paid tuition at the college.
MCENANY: That has nothing to do with race. So, that is the thing we want to see everything to the --
There had been white people kicked out of the rally. There had been Hispanic people there -- it has nothing to do with race.
RYE: And why were they quiet in getting kicked out of the rally?
BOLDUAN: Go ahead, John.
AVALON: But unfortunately a lot of the polarization or politics right now doesn't have to do with race.
AVALON: And that is not a new one candidates' poll. I mean, you know, race is a real signifier between the two parties particularly in primaries if you look at turn-out numbers.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Right.
AVALON: And then if you have candidates who are trying to really stoke anger at immigration or Muslims and, you know, that bleeds over, and I think the ugliest aspects of the politics today is an impulse towards a mob mentally. We are seeing a particularly social online mobs, social media mobs, people who try to intimidate folks who disagree sometime, you know, and especially rallies -- historically, it can get out of hand, because people are willing to do things in a group that they would never do individually.
BERMAN: I would have turn the page right now really on this discussion we look forward right now. I want to talk about tomorrow. Tomorrow, we are voting Democrats in Maine, right?
BERMAN: And Republicans are in Puerto Rico, and then on Tuesday, it is Michigan, Mississippi, Idaho and I'm leaving out one. Hawaii. So, Jackie, you know, what are the next four days look like in this campaign and who lines up best in the next four days.
KUCINICH: I think that around the table, we decided Marco Rubio was the only candidate to go to Puerto Rico this time, which is kind of their folly, Puerto Rico is kind of nice.
But, you know, but also delegates that maybe Marco Rubio --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's 23.
KUCINICH: Right. Right. That maybe Marco Rubio will have an edge with because he actually visited. Now, Michigan is going to be a huge fight on both sides. Bernie Sanders is really contending for the agitating for the labor vote in Michigan and Hillary Clinton has also been spending a lot of time there. On that side, and then the John Kasich -- John Kasich, well, there is a one outlier poll. Trump isn't leading in every other poll, and then all of a sudden there is this ARG poll that had Kasich up by two. I don't know if I believe that yet but John Kasich --
BOLDUAN: He is making a play for Michigan. That's for sure.
KUCINICH: He is making a big play for Michigan. And it's going to, if he actually does well, and even if he comes in second that is to the detriment of Marco Rubio and to the benefit of John Kasich.
BERMAN: Ted Cruz is out in Idaho right now like campaigning hard. He is in Idaho right now. I think that because he wants a win on the board on Tuesday, right?
AVALON: Absolutely. You have four states, and that is where he is most likely to have a win. Conservative states, low turnout so that is his bet because he wants to keep on the leaderboard with wins, whereas Marco has got to show, and Kasich has got to show --
BOLDUAN: I mean, it looks, to be honest, does Marco Rubio just need to absolutely park it in Florida for the next week?
BEINART: He is. I was just going to schedule. He is basically going to be parking it in Florida for the next week. He basically is parking --
BOLDUAN: And right before, just yesterday he cancelled a bunch of events, went to Kansas and had sometime there. I don't think we're going to see any scrambling of -- scrambling of campaign schedule, Peter. I think it's going to be --
BEINART: And maybe if you are really looking at the tea leaves from Marco Rubio in a positive way, you could say that the fact that Cruz is going to compete harder could actually help him. Because we know that Rubio is weakest in the panhandle in Northern Florida. You saw how poorly he did across the border in Georgia. That's presumably where Cruz would have strength. So, maybe Cruz takes from Trump there. And then in a three-way race, Rubio strengthen in South Florida allows him to eke-out the win. Again, it's a bit farfetched, but if you are Rubio's position now, this is the kind of thinking you have to do.
BOLDUAN: Let me ask you this. The fact that John Kasich did not do better in Kentucky, does that tell us anything about Ohio? I mean, they are a Cincinnati suburbs that are running in Kentucky. What do you think?
KUCINICH: Well, I think that Trump might end up winning the parts of Ohio that border that part of the state, but when you look at where Kasich won in 2014, some of his biggest totals were in Northeastern Ohio and Northwestern Ohio and you also have the blue collar part of Ohio that runs along the northwestern Ohio and Kasich has huge totals there for his gubernatorial race, so you have to figure that, those loyal voters are going to stick with him.
AVALON: Interestingly there was an item in the Youngstown "Vindicator," my mother's hometown this weekend that a thousand Democrats are trying to re-register Republican to be to vote for Donald Trump particularly in that northeast corridor of the state where there are a lot of, you know, white blue -- white working class folks, there does seem to be a move that Donald Trump is depending on them to make an electability argument.
MCENANY: One thing to point out though. Kasich has a 62 percent approval rating in Ohio. That is unprecedented. Almost for any governor, I think it is going to be so hard to beat him on his home turf with that kind of approval rating. People in Ohio loved him. Maybe Trump will have a won. That's an encouraging --
AVALON: I am not predicting a winner but --
(TALKING OVER EACH OTHER)
[01:29:05] BERMAN: If you want to hear about the Hawaii caucuses which are Tuesday, right?
BERMAN: Tweet us, and we will talk about it after the break.
One of us, I would love to go. I would love to go research.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All I know is I am ready to go.
BERMAN: Well, I don't know anything about them, to be completely honest, I would love to know if there is a favorite right now in Hawaii. So, tweet us, and we will read it out loud after the break. We will know a lot more of this guy. You know, Donald Trump held his news conference. We're going to talk more about that. We're also going to look forward to not just this Tuesday, but a big CNN debate, two debates this week. Three debates this week, right? Flint, Univision, and then the Republicans in Florida.
BOLDUAN: Yep. In Miami.
BERMAN: We have a lot going on. We'll be right back.
[01:34:00] BOLDUAN: And we are back, folks, live.
BOLDUAN: Live, live, live, live, with CNN's special coverage of Super Saturday. Margaret, hold it together. As much of the U.S. rolls over into Sunday, we now has the results of five more primary states contests in the books, folks. Folks, here is what the voters decided on this Super Saturday. Ted Cruz in Kansas crushing the competition with 48.2 percent of the vote. Taking more than double the number of votes cast for second place, Donald Trump. Cruz also won Maine with 49.9 percent of the vote. Donald Trump taking second. John Kasich polling out a third place win beating Marco Rubio there. Donald Trump claimed two Super Tuesday -- Super, whatever you want to call it.
BERMAN: Saturday. BOLDUAN: Thank you sir. Saturday victories, first in Louisiana with
Cruz in second followed by Rubio and in Kentucky friends. Where Trump narrowly edged out Ted Cruz there.
BERMAN: All right. The Democratic race now.
BOLDUAN: I know. Big win for Bernie Sanders in Kansas, he claimed more than two thirds of the votes. He also took home Nebraska. He has 203 there for Bernie Sanders in Nebraska and Kansas. But Hillary Clinton won the biggest price by yes, a very big margin in Louisiana, a very big win in Louisiana. The delegate math there might end up being about equal for Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton. Now, shortly after being declared the winner in Kentucky and Louisiana, Donald Trump held a news conference, he insulted Ted Cruz, he insulted Marco Rubio, he insulted Mitt Romney, listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Millions and millions of people are coming in and voting, and they have never seen anything like it before. Actually they are doing coverage on "Time" magazine, because it is a movement. What is happening is a movement. And I'm very honored to the say that if I were not involved that would not be happening. Actually I am kidding. But I say I am not kidding, because I want them to say I am a nice person. But you know, you are talking about millions and millions of people, and we have a dynamic party and as a party we should come together and stop this foolishness. You know, we have something, and I was thinking about it to today for the first time, the establishment is very unhappy with the way that things are going. And I can understand that.
Although, I used to be a part of the establishment. You know, seven months ago before I decided to run I was part of the establishment, but now I am not part of the establishment. And once I announced I was running, they said, what is he doing? Why is he running? He is not supposed to be running. We want people that we can control. We want people that we can give money to so that if we want something for pharmaceuticals or for electric or for utilities or for a lumber or for oil and gas, we have total control over a senator or a congressman. So, you know, I am self-funding. I am not taking the money, they have no control, I am going to do what is right for the American people, and that is very really simple.
Lying Ted, I call him lying Ted. He holds up the bible and then he puts it down and he lies. OK? Lying Ted. I have never saw a man that lied as much. And lying Ted, and what he did to Ben Carson was a disgrace and actually me, because had he not gotten those Ben Carson votes, I would have won Iowa too. I would have had everything. So no, Ted was -- I mean, and what he did frankly when he did voter violation on a form that looked like it came right out of a government agency, voter violation, and the only way you get rid of the violation essentially is by voting, and going and voting for Ted Cruz, you ever see this?
And people did that because they were afraid, it was terrible. It was a very fraudulent thing, and he has done a lot of bad things. So, Ben Carson is a great guy. He is a great, great guy, and I thought that it was a disgrace what he did to, he said basically that Ben Carson is out of the race. Come on vote for me, and he knew it was happening.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: Just a small taste of Donald Trump who made a joke about Ted Cruz saying of course, he won Maine, it is close to Canada. Also said Marco Rubio should drop out of the race.
BOLDUAN: Yes. He did. And Marco Rubio's campaign responded shockingly saying they will not be dropping out. Just want to make sure we're clear on that. Stay with us, everyone. A lot more to come. Got to talk about big debates coming up. Yep, and they are all CNN debates. We have a big CNN debate for the Democrats in Flint, Michigan. You see a look at the debate hall right now getting ready and gearing up Sunday, and that would be later today. And then we have got another big debate, GOP debate in Miami, that is this Thursday. Florida, Florida, Florida, folks. Watch out.
BERMAN: All right. We'll be right back.
[01:43:06] BERMAN: All right. Welcome back to our CNN election coverage of Super Saturday which is now turned into salacious Sunday. John and Kate plus five.
BOLDUAN: Oh, no. The children.
BERMAN: And so we are around the table right now. CNN has got a bunch of big debates this week. We have Flint, Michigan debates tomorrow night. Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders. We are simulcasting Univision debate Wednesday night with the Democrats. And Then Thursday night, the Republicans in Miami. Let's start backwards, work towards us, John Avalon, the Republican debate. What are we going to see?
AVALON: Look, I mean, you know, you're going to need to see really Kasich branch out. You're going to need to see Cruz dominate a debate because he got left in it, in the dust in the last one. Cruz is going to continue I supposed the quixotic mission to show he is the responsible Republican which is an odd fit for him. And Donald Trump has diminish he return for these debates at this point. I mean, he's getting the hell kicked out of him, he can't really win, he can just basically tolerate them and you can see the disdain on his face as he takes all of the incoming. It hasn't seem to conclusively hurt his support. But there's not a lot of upset for Donald Trump in this debate.
BERMAN: I think it is the last one.
AVALON: I mean, the last one we know off too.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. The last one, of course, Super Tuesday. AVALON: And look, we are officially in the stretch here, folks, I mean, if momentum done a significant shift by the 15th, it is, you know, game over and we will know how the field is set.
BOLDUAN: Look, now that we've seen, there are no exit or entrance polls. So, it is difficult to know what was driving a lot of where voters landed on Super Saturday. But Margaret, when you look at what -- how the last debate played out, Rubio and Cruz taking it to Trump, taking it to Trump, and largely leaving each other alone. And then now you have seen that Rubio did not have a very good night in Super Saturday. Do you think Rubio takes Trump on again? Do you think Rubio takes Cruz on again? Why is the Rubio strategy? It seems he has got a lot at stake in this debate?
MARGARET HOOVER, REPUBLICAN CONSULTANT: Well, Rubio has everything at stake in this debate, because Rubio has to win in Florida and right now every poll says that he is losing by large double digits. I mean, maybe 10, 18, 20 points.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Huge. Huge.
HOOVER: Huge, Donald Trump might say. The debates matter though. Did you make a difference? Rubio strategy. All of their strategy on beating up on the Trump seem to be working. I mean, Trump is taking it in. I mean, he is suffering some, I mean, if there is anything that comes out of tonight, I think it is real-heartened sense that the #Never Trump movement might be going somewhere because there maybe alternatives. And maybe Cruz, but it many some of the others. Look, the states tonight were not good for Kasich, they were not good for Rubio. That is the other thing that's going to change in this next week. So, we are going to see an opportunity for them to start accumulating delegates as soon as today frankly in Puerto Rico with Marco Rubio.
BERMAN: Professor, skip ahead past the debates, past the primaries, past you know, the conventions now and tell me if the race ended, you know, like it looks like it might today with Hillary Clinton versus Donald Trump, what is that end up looking like?
PROFESSOR JULIAN ZELIZER, PRINCETON UNIVERSITY: Well, it is obviously be a very vicious campaign. I think that is clear, because Hillary Clinton would provide a perfect foil for the kind of arguments that Donald Trump wants to make about the direction of the country, about the risks that the country faces, and the Clintons are very aggressive. They've been since the war room in 1992, and they will not let Donald Trump just get away with that. So, it will be very aggressive. I think it would also turn into a debate about the issues. I think it would force Donald Trump to clarify some kinds of positions more than he has in the primary. And Hillary Clinton has learned something from these primaries that issues matter, ideas matter, and that she can't just run on experience. So I do think you could be set up for pretty tough and more ideological campaign than you think given who Donald Trump is.
AVALON: But Hillary Clinton's problems as a candidate have never been is that she's allergic to issues, right? If anything, she is too much of a policy wonk, right? What I think the one of the unintended consequences of that kind of a matchup could be however is that Hillary Clinton's persistent enthusiasm gap automatically gets erased, if there is a hope for the Obama coalition to not only stay united but grow given the changing demographics of the country, and just the fact that the, you know, a new cohort of millennials gets ready to vote. It is the prospect of running against Donald Trump. You think we saw high Latino and African-American turnout in the past, I think that is going to go up. And whatever pivots Donald Trump has in mind, that is going to tough to compete with.
ZELIZER: Well, and that's one other thing. I mean, and it's done it already in the primaries. I think part of Sanders' slide is Donald Trump rather than Hillary Clinton. It has raised the stakes of these election for many Democrats. The idea of Donald Trump being president scares a lot of Democrats so does Ted Cruz. And I think the effect of that has actually been to garner support for the safer of the two Democrats, many people don't want to take a risk of the --
BOLDUAN: Go ahead, Kayleigh.
MCENANY: Well, you know, however nonsensical it may sound in terms of ideology. I think you're going to see in the general election. Possibly Donald Trump sweep in some of the Sanders' support which is mindboggling, because they are so different, but he really has the potential to sweep this in and put states like Michigan in play. That being said, Donald Trump has to be very careful in taking on Hillary Clinton because there is a gender dynamic when it's a one on one debate with a female and a male. And it is very important to be measured, tough, but polite. So, I really think we'll see a different Donald Trump. It's important that we do.
[01:48:17] BERMAN: Jackie, I wanted you to be the last word in our discussion.
KUCINICH: Oh, man!
BERMAN: Sum up the entire evening and tell me what is going to happen. Tell me you -- next Saturday night at this time which, you know, is a possibility we could be here as far as I know. What are we going to talk about next Saturday at this time?
KUCINICH: We are going to be talking about Marco Rubio and whether he is going to drop out frankly. I mean, if he does not do well, if he does not perform well in these debates coming up -- in the Republican debate coming up in Miami and that kind of bleeds into the 15th, I just -- I don't see where he gets any other states. Because he needs this.
BOLDUAN: Real quick, what does that mean though in terms of if he doesn't perform? If it sticks with the issues or is it to take on the hands? Because when he has the hands comment everything else that kind of encapsulates and exemplifies, he was getting a lot of attention and his crowds loved it. He was getting a lot of the headlines, but is that the way to go in the debate?
KUCINICH: It is not what his message was coming into this, he kind of -- his brand is different now as a result. He needs to show that he wants this. And, you know, up until are recently it didn't seem like he wanted it but he needs to do it, and in theory, I'm not a strategist but --
KUCINICH: It seems like there needs to be a balance, right? To be able to take it to Donald Trump and also stay good on this message and we'll see if he can -- you imagine this week as the debate is preparing.
BOLDUAN: They need to get it right in terms of how to take on Donald Trump effectively and not get countered.
BERMAN: And sometime before the inauguration day they have to get it right, and that's been the issue I think for these other people running.
BOLDUAN: We get plenty of time to discuss it.
BERMAN: That is not my joke.
All right, guys. A lot more to discuss. We are live counting the votes from Super Saturday. We will be right back.
[01:53:51] BERMAN: All right. We have seen it so many times in this election, one bad night can make a big, big difference in this campaign.
BOLDUAN: It is one of the themes really explored in the new CNN series, "Race For The White House" a revealing look at six of the most ruthless presidential races in U.S. history. Here is a sneak peek.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They're asked if they want makeup and Jack Kennedy says, no, and Nixon who wants to be manly says, well, I don't need it either. Meanwhile, Kennedy goes back and get some max factor applied to him. And Nixon sends somebody down to Michigan Avenue to buy some hideous shave stick which he rubs on like grease across his face. Nixon was pacing around the studios, he was asking people questions.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think that I better shave.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, it was past time for all of those questions.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Studio, 30 seconds to air.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Kennedy did not present himself until he was fully ready. He was not going to stand around with Richard Nixon and chat before the main event, he was going to come in like the prize fighter he was. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And Nixon made every mistake you could think of in
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Look at the faces of the two candidates in this debate. And ask yourself, who is presidential, and who is scared.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The contrast is dramatic.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLDUAN: All right. Be sure to tune in tonight at 10:00 Eastern for the CNN original series "Race For The White House" narrated by Oscar winner Kevin Spacey.
BERMAN: It is really freaking good. And make sure you watch it. Now, Super Saturday, that was yesterday. It is now on a salacious Sunday and wins on Saturday for the top four candidates and big losses for other folks, too.
BOLDUAN: So, Sunday which is all of two hours' old now, opens a new chapters which results in two places, the democratic caucuses in Maine and the Republican primary in Puerto Rico. And tonight also at 8:00 Eastern, two Democrats are going to go head-to-head in Flint, Michigan for a CNN debate making their case to voters and trying to win the delegates they need to lock down the nomination. That is right here on CNN.
BERMAN: It will be fascinating. I'm John Berman, everyone.
BOLDUAN: Whoa! I think I'm still Kate Bolduan. Thank you so much for watching, everybody.
BERMAN: Have a great morning.