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Trump Delivers Searing Attack on Clinton; Trump: "Clinton Used State Dept. As Personal Hedge Fund"; Ron Paul Talks Libertarian Election Chances; Rep John Lewis Heads Sit-In in House over Gun Legislation. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired June 22, 2016 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[13:30:00] TOM FOREMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Now beyond that, what troubles a lot of people a lot more is the government of Brunei did give $1 million to $5 million to the Clinton Foundation. That does worry a lot of people out there. But because Donald Trump conflated the two and acted like they were the same, we have to say his claim about this is true but misleading.

There's a whole lot more to be checked, as there will be, to check on her when she speaks in about an hour.

You can find out about all of it, Wolf, by going to CNN.com/realitycheck.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: All right. We will stand by for more of that.

Tom Foreman, thanks very much.

Let's bring in our panel to talk about Donald Trump's big speech today. Our chief political correspondent, Dana Bash, is with us; our chief political analyst, Gloria Borger is with. Also with us, our CNN political analyst, David Gregory, the host of "The David Gregory Show" podcast.

Dana, was this speech that Trump delivered today, carefully scripted, carefully drafted, he read it once again from the teleprompter, is this the kind of speech Republicans have been hoping for?

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: It certainly is in that you just described what he did, which he hasn't been doing until now. He has, despite disparaging Hillary Clinton for using a teleprompter, he's used them for the past handful of speeches.

Most importantly, he laid out in a cogent way what his arguments are and are going to be against Hillary Clinton and in favor of his own candidacy. He really hasn't done this kind of speech to date. He had a lot of catch phrases, "She says, I'm with her, I'm going to be with America." A lot of memorable lines. But most importantly, he began to lay out why the American people completely feeding into one of her vulnerabilities, her biggest vulnerabilities, which is trustworthiness and honesty. We saw those numbers yesterday in our own poll.

The other thing I thought was fascinating is he went back to basics from the primary campaign, the things that work so well for him. He's an outsider. She's an insider. He talked about corruption and the rigged system. That is really is the kind of thing that connected with voters. They're sick of Washington and sick of feeling like they are left out of economy. He described all of that as rigged and that he's the person who can come in. Whether or not that's going to resonate, who knows, but it's a first step that Republicans who I talked are breathing a bit of sigh of about.

BLITZER: Gloria, you note that Donald Trump repeated some of the criticisms we heard earlier from Bernie Sanders that the political and economic systems are rigged against ordinary Americans. He even seemed to reach out directly to the Bernie Sanders supporters. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: The insiders wrote the rules of the game to keep themselves this power and in the money. That's why we're asking Bernie Sanders voters to join our movement so, together, we can fix the system for all Americans. So important.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Gloria, how likely is it that appeal to Bernie Sanders supporters will work for Trump?

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Look, I don't think it's very likely that a majority or even a significant percentage of Bernie Sanders voters will end up voting for Donald Trump, but I don't blame him for trying. Obviously, the appeal of the outsider has resonance with them. It could also resonate with Independent voters who believe the system is rigged and don't like Washington and like the notion of an outsider.

One other thing I want to raise is not only did he hit Hillary Clinton on her Achilles heel, which is you're crooked and your a liar and her trust numbers are terrible, but he also added ineptitude to this list. She was inept during Benghazi. She was asleep at the switch. I think this will be another line of attack you'll see coming from him in the future. This appeals, of course, to Republicans.

BLITZER: David, he said very, very strong words. Hillary Clinton may be the "most corrupt person to seek the presidency of the United States.". "A world-class liar," he said. He said she "perfected the politics of personal profit and theft." Is this an effective strategy for him going forward?

DAVID GREGORY, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST & HOST, "THE DAVID GREGORY SHOW" PODCAST: I don't think, on the merits, it is, because that's going to be argued back and forth. Her team will respond forcefully. I think it will be muddled for a lot of Americans paying attention, trying to make heads or tails.

What's important is twofold. One, he's getting all this credit for campaign 101, which is give a pretty cogent speech attacking your opponent. It shows how far he's fallen. Two, he wants the attention off himself. He wants it about her. This is now Trump on the attack against his opponent. This is the place he needs to be. He's had a horrible month, really a threshold month on whether he can wage an effective campaign. Here he is really trying to make this a campaign not a referendum about him, but a comparison with her. I think that's got to be a relief to donors, a relief to the Republican establishment who have questioned whether or not he can make it to November.

[11:35:] BLITZER: All right, David, standby.

Gloria, Dana, stand by as well.

An important note to our viewers. CNN hosts a presidential town hall with the Libertarian ticket, Gary Johnson, and his vice presidential pick, William Weld, later tonight, 9:00 p.m. eastern, only on CNN, moderated by Chris Cuomo.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:40:23] BLITZER: In a searing attack on Hillary Clinton, Donald Trump not only targeted her paid speeches but accused her of abusing her position as secretary of state. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Hillary Clinton has perfected the politics of personal profit and even theft. She ran the State Department like her own personal hedge fund.

(APPLAUSE)

TRUMP: Then when she left, she made $21.6 million giving speeches to Wall Street banks and other special interests, and in less than two years, secret speeches that she does not want to reveal under any circumstances to the public. I wonder why.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: All right. Let's talk about this. Very, very serious attack.

Joining us, our CNN political commentator and Donald Trump supporter, Jeffrey Lord; and also joining us, our CNN political commentator and Hillary Clinton supporter, Bakari Sellers.

Bakari, let me get your reaction to what we just heard from Donald Trump.

BAKARI SELLERS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I thought Donald Trump's attacks were scandalous and salacious and slanderous in nature. I thought his speech was meandering. I know he called Hillary Clinton a world-class liar, but we only saw was a speech filled with lies. You can't divorce the message from the messenger. This is the same

person who is talking about Hillary Clinton enriching herself. But he stole from students at Trump University. This is the same person who hoped for a housing crash so he could capitalize on that. Donald Trump is not someone who can stand up there and have any moral authority to launch these attacks. And I think the American public will see right through that.

BLITZER: Jeffrey, Donald Trump said Hillary Clinton has, quote, "spent her entire life making money for special interests." He's bragged about using bankruptcy, in his words, "brilliantly," for being -- he called himself the king of debt. Just released federal filings, revealed nearly one-fifth of the Trump campaign went to his own businesses, if you will, where he had an event in Palm Beach and Mira- Lago. He would reimburse Mira-Lago from the campaign or Trump Tower. How do you square all that?

JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Wolf, he's a private businessman, number one. And what he's talking about here, which is very, very powerful, having read Hillary Clinton's speech where she attacks wall street, this is what people think is the problem. This is a game. The Democratic Party and Hillary Clinton specifically, those speeches, $21 million worth of speeches given to, among other things, to all of these powerful banks and Wall Street institutions.

She's not going to release the transcripts. They play a game with this. They go out there and they denounce these people and then they take their money. They do this all the time. She's not the first to do this. When she denounces the housing crisis and Donald Trump on housing, let us not forget that it was President Clinton's housing strategy that Gretchen Morganson, who wrote "Reckless Endangerment," which is the tale of all of this, she was "The New York Times" reporter, wrote the tale of all of this --

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: Very quickly --

(CROSSTALK)

Jeffrey, he's accusing her of not releasing the transcripts of her paid speeches to some wall street firms, but Donald Trump is refusing to release his IRS -- his tax returns. Every presidential candidate has done so over the past 40 years, going back to Nixon. Shouldn't he release his tax returns?

LORD: Wolf, I have to say, I'm opposed to this at this point. I think this has become a game. If you remember, Harry Reid standing up there on the Senate floor and accusing Mitt Romney of all kinds of things about his taxes. What people want to do is go through this. I think he'll probably release them any way. But I'm definitely opposed to this. Because what they want to do is find something in there to embarrass him.

She gave a speech, a public speech, to this group. There's no reason in the world you can't release this. This is not her tax returns. This is about public policy.

BLITZER: Bakari, why not release the transcripts of those speeches?

SELLERS: Well, I think that Hillary Clinton has said it from the beginning, and one thing that people fail to realize, and even Jeffrey Lord fails to realize, is that before Donald Trump was running for president in 2000, he was bragging to "The New York Times" and everyone else about these speeches he was making to Wall Street. She said the exact same thing. When everyone is held to the same standards, she'll release the speeches.

But more importantly, what we do know about Donald Trump is one, he will not release his taxes. I hate to pivot on you, Wolf, and move back to that, but that's very important. You have someone talking about tax plan. He talked about his tax plan -- today he talked about his tax plan that will devastate our economy. But we know from the years we have seen his tax returns, he's paid zero in taxes. I mean, this shows this person is just built -- we learned at his campaign is built on a scam. It's just enriching and benefitting his family. I believe his whole empire -- I use that word loosely -- may just be built on cards.

[11:45:14] BLITZER: We're not going to resolve this. Unfortunately, we're out of time. But we will continue these conversations, as both you well know.

Take a look at this. We're getting live pictures right now from Raleigh, North Carolina, where Hillary Clinton will take the stage. Will she respond to Donald Trump's blistering attacks? We'll hear what she has to say.

Also, Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump are not the only two people in this race. Gary Johnson, the Libertarian, is starting to find some footing in the polls. Tonight, he's getting national platform right here on CNN at the Libertarian town hall. Up next, I'll ask Ron Paul, who once led the Libertarian ticket, what he thinks about this presidential contest right now. There you see him, Ron Paul, standing by live. We'll discuss right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:49:57] BLITZER: We're following the breaking news in Washington. A showdown over gun control playing out right now on the floor of the United States House of Representatives. Take a look at these live pictures on this sit-in, this protest movement that's happening right now on the House floor. Congressman John Lewis is leading the sit-in protest. Lewis and other lawmakers are demanding that Republicans address gun control and gun violence. President Obama just tweeted his support, his tweet reads, quote, "Thank you, John Lewis, for leading on gun violence where we need it most."

We're standing by. Hopefully, we'll speak with Congressman Lewis momentarily. Get an update how long this sit-in will continue. The speaker of the House has pointed out they are violating the rules of the House of Representatives, which is now in recess. But there's other news we're following right now including this. Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump aren't the only Americans who are running for president of the United States. Gary Johnson, the former governor of New Mexico, he's also running. He's leading the Libertarian Party ticket.

Tonight, he'll take center stage at CNN's Libertarian town hall to make his case to voters. The Libertarian nominee believes in limited government. For example, he wants to eliminate the IRS, the Internal Revenue Service, as we know it, do away with the federal Department of Education. When it comes to immigration, he wants to make it easier to enter the United States legally. And on the issue of abortion, he supports a woman's right to choose, which he adds, has been the law for several decades.

Recent polling, by the way, is on Gary Johnson's side, shows him gaining traction right now in our latest CNN/ORC poll. He's polling at 9 percent. Sometimes in other polls getting as high as 12 percent.

So in a year that's veered away from all norms, could a third-party candidate actually attract more voters than ever?

Joining us now is former U.S. Congressman and three-time presidential candidate, Ron Paul.

Congressman, you ran on the Libertarian Party ticket back in 1988. Later, you tried to get the Republican Party nomination, didn't make it. Both Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump right now have pretty high unfavorability ratings. Do you think this could be an election where this Libertarian Party candidate has a real shot?

RON PAUL, (R), FORMER TEXAS CONGRESSMAN & FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think it's a real opportunity. I don't want to be so bold as a real shot and tell people that I'm predicting that he's going to win. But I think it's a real opportunity, and who knows what will happen. You know, there may be some charges made against one of the candidates. Who knows what will happen between now and Election Day? But, no, I think this is a year that somebody in an alternative party should do very well because the people are so disgusted. Even though there's a big fight between Republicans and Democrats, you know, the negatives are huge. And for me, as a Libertarian, I sort of wonder about this because, strictly speaking, when you look at the issues, I don't see a whole lot of difference, because they both like government a lot more than Libertarians do.

BLITZER: I'm curious, Congressman, who will you vote for?

PAUL: I haven't decided yet. Probably -- I'm not going to vote for Trump or Hillary. And I'll vote for the Libertarian Party. I'm not endorsing people because there are some shortcomings there.

But the principles of Libertarianism are very important to me. And I've been involved in politics to try to present the case for nonviolence and non-aggression principles and a foreign policy that works for peace rather than endless undeclared wars. So under these circumstances, I think people who say that they want to -- want significant change, they want to protect individual liberty, concerned about the Constitution, they should think seriously about voting for a Libertarian principle. And that's what I intend to do.

BLITZER: You're a former member of the House of Representatives, sir, for many years, from Texas. Democrats are holding a sit-in on the House floor right now to push for gun control legislation following the Orlando tragedy. Where do you stand on this?

PAUL: Well, I still believe in the Constitution, and I believe in the Second Amendment. But I'm for gun control. Where the real killing is going on is our guns and in our military going overseas and bombing and killing and starting wars that aren't necessary, and selling weapons. We're selling -- we're putting weapons in the hands of ISIS, you know, in Syria. Those are the real guns of war that we should be dealing with. And, of course, if we're really worried about guns on the streets, why has it been totally ignored -- a lot more people are dying in our inner cities. Crime on weekends is just out of control.

So we need more, you know, police activity to try to protect some people, but property management, that is preventing the rights of an individual to own a piece of property, whether it's a knife or a gun, is protected, and that shouldn't be the issue. I do not think it will achieve anything. And since I'm one that's very much in favor of non- aggression and violence, I would be for it if I thought it reduced the violence. But it will not, and, therefore, I will defend the Second Amendment.

BLITZER: Congressman Ron Paul, thanks very much for joining us.

PAUL: Thank you, Wolf.

[13:55:11] BLITZER: Let's get back to the breaking news right now. House Democrats holding a sit-in on the floor of the House of Representatives demanding action on gun control. The initiative led by Congressman John Lewis.

He's joining us now live from Capitol Hill.

President Obama, as you know, Congressman, just tweeted support for you. Let me read it once again. He said, "Thank you, John Lewis, for leading on gun violence where we need it most."

How long do you plan to remain in protest on the House floor with this sit-in?

REP. JOHN LEWIS (D), GEORGIA: Well, I must tell you that I'm delighted and very pleased that the president of the United States was sending me such a message. It is wonderful. It is very moving.

We will continue to sit. You know, many years ago, when I was only 20 years old, I participated in sit-ins, and by sitting down, we were really standing up. So by sitting down or sitting in with my colleagues in the well of the House today, we'll send to the Republican leadership, to the speaker and others, it is time to bring the bills to the floor and let us pass these bills and not take a break. Too many of our children, too many of our sisters and brothers, our mothers and fathers, our friends, our cousins are dying by guns. And we have to do something about it. We cannot wait. We cannot afford to take a break and go home. We should stay here until we pass the bills.

BLITZER: So you can stay for hours, maybe even overnight, days, is that what I'm hearing?

LEWIS: We don't have any intention of leaving any time soon. I will continue to confer with my colleagues. We'll continue to plan. But we're going to sit-in for a while or sit down for a while.

BLITZER: The speaker of the House, Paul Ryan, issued a statement. I'll read it to you, Congressman. He said, "The House cannot operate without members following the rules of the institution, so the House is recessed subject to the call of the chair."

He's accusing you of violating the rules of the House of Representatives, which is a strong accusation, a strong charge. Tell our viewers why you're violating those rules.

LEWIS: Sometimes you have to violate a rule or law to uphold a greater law or moral law. We -- we have a right to stand up, to speak up, to speak out. And we have a right to sit down or to sit-in, to engage in nonviolent protests. It is always right to do right.

BLITZER: Do you think if you did get a roll call, a vote on this legislation that would prevent someone from buying a gun other in the United States, if he or she were on not-fly list or the terror watch list, given the fact that the Republicans have a decisive majority in the House of Representatives, would that legislation even pass?

LEWIS: It's my belief that we should test the legislation on the floor. Put it on the floor, and almost every single Democratic member will vote for that legislation. And I think we can get enough Republican colleagues to vote for it.

BLITZER: Because, as you know, they tried four pieces of legislation on the Senate side the other day, and all of them could not get the required 60 votes to break a filibuster, 60 out of 100. So the legislation, there's some compromise moves in the Senate. We'll see if that gets the 60 votes. But if there's no effort in the Senate, would your effort, even if you were to succeed in the House, be in vain if it doesn't pass in the Senate as well?

LEWIS: Let's pass it. Let's try to pass it. Let's do the right thing. The American people, more than 85 percent of the American people, Democrats and Republicans, want us to do something, to act, and now is the time for action.

BLITZER: Have you discussed this with the speaker of the House, with the majority leader, Kevin McCarthy? Have you had any conversations with those two Republican leaders in advance of this sit-in?

LEWIS: Our leadership is engaged in ongoing discussion and conversation with the leadership on the Republican side. We didn't tell them that we were going to sit-in, that we were going to occupy the well of the House.

BLITZER: You did not?

LEWIS: We did not.

BLITZER: Do you think you should talk to them and see if you can work out some arrangement?

LEWIS: Well, I think it's up to them now to come and talk to us. We were move what we felt we had to do and were moved by what I call the spirit of history to find a way to get in the way.

BLITZER: Congressman John Lewis, thanks so much for joining us. Appreciate your joining us here on CNN.

We'll continue to follow this dramatic development in the House of Representatives.

I'm Wolf Blitzer, in Washington.

The news continues right now right here on CNN.