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ANDERSON COOPER 360 DEGREES
Clinton Picks Sen. Kaine as VP; Clinton: Kaine "Believes No Problem is Unsolvable"; Police: 10 Killed in Munich Shooting Spree, Including Gunman; Police: Munich Shooter 18 Year Old German-Iranian; Gunman Was Not Known to Police, His Motives Unclear; NY Mag: MH370 Pilot Flew Suicide Route on Home Simulator; Fact Checking Trump's Convention Speech; Undecided Voters on Trump's Speech. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired July 22, 2016 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN AC360 ANCHOR: We begin though with Hillary Clinton making the biggest decision since deciding to run for president, naming Virginia Senator and Former Governor Tim Kaine as her running mate.
Secretary Clinton tweeting "I'm thrilled to announce my running mate Tim Kaine, a man who's devoted his life to fighting for others." Senator Cory Booker used even fewer characters, tweeting "Kaine is able," ba-dum bop.
So is CNN's Jeff Zeleny, who joins us now. So of course -- I mean, Secretary Clinton making her V.P. choice, Former Governor Tim Kaine, talk to me about him. What do we know about him? What's the appeal of him for Secretary Clinton?
JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Anderson, at the end of the day, she was looking for a governing partner. She told you that earlier this summer in one of her first interviews after her long primary fight with Bernie Sanders. But let's go back to that, she didn't even consider Bernie Sanders. Now that was something that was discussed about at the time after their long primary fight, if she would have to sort of go through the motions of that.
In those early conversations they have, they both decided I'm told it would not be a good idea so she announced early on she was not considering him. She did consider a wide array of people but in many ways, her list was pretty small. She knew Tim Kaine was someone who she respected intellectually I'm told. He'd been a governor. She liked his executive experience and also do not discount the tight connections he has to Virginia. The current governor of Virginia, Terry McAuliffe, very close to the Clintons. He's very close to Tim Kaine. There was a comfort level there, I'm told.
But he's also someone who's somewhat of a moderate. He certainly does not fit this liberal strain of the party but this is that early indicator of how she, if elected, would govern. This is -- you know, she did not want someone whose liberal policies were sort of going up against her in the west wing but we just got a tweet from him actually, his first comments since he was picked. Let's take a look at this. He said "I just got off the phone with Hillary. I'm honored to be her running mate. Can't wait to hit the trail tomorrow in Miami." And that is significant as well, Anderson, making the announcement here in Miami, not in his home state of Virginia, is key that Florida once again ground zero presidential politics, wants to make clear that diversity and other things will be front and center in this campaign. We've talked a lot about -- it's not about how he's a Spanish speaker, that's a central part of his biography but certainly not the only part.
COOPER: You've also been learning a lot of the details on how the decision was made, when it was made and when he was informed and others.
ZELLENY: It's interesting, Anderson, he was -- just received a call tonight at 7:32 p.m. eastern time. He was in Newport, Rhode Island at a fundraiser for one of his fellow democrats in the Senate and he got a call from her, finally giving him the nod. I saw him a couple days ago this week in Virginia. He seemed confident, of course, he wouldn't talk about any of this because he's sworn to secrecy throughout this process, but he did not know until this evening.
And this was kept so secret. It was an edict from the very top to keep this as tightlipped as possible in part because of how Donald Trump's vice presidential search unfolded. The Clinton campaign was watching that in astonishment. It also, you know, goes to the heart of who Hillary Clinton is.
But Anderson, I think it cannot be said enough. This is the first time she has truly chosen a partner of her own. She's been at her husband's side. This is someone that she has picked. So now tomorrow when they come out here in Miami, he will be her partner, certainly will look so much different than that 1992 image of the Clintons and the Gores here. But she believes she is someone now who A, she wants to have around, she likes his company and she believes he'll help electorally here. But reality is though Anderson, this race is about the top of the ticket. Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, we talked about the V's now but it's about Clinton.
COOPER: Yeah, Jeff, stay with us. We want to bring in our chief political analyst, Gloria Borger, also chief political correspondent, Dana Bash. Gloria, you know, to Jeff's point about, you know she was -- she's obviously been in the White House before, she has seen how presidents and vice presidents interact. How much do you think that experience shaped her thinking on this?
GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAN ANALYST: I think an awful lot. I mean, she knows when it works as it did with Clinton and Gore early on and she knows what happens when it doesn't work. And you know, I think that she understands that this is the person that when the door closes and every other adviser is gone, and leaves with the president, this is the person who will give the president advice and the last piece of advice.
And I think that's very important to her. Look, she understands the downside of Tim Kaine. They both look like a bunch of insiders, in fact, that's what Donald Trump texted to contributors tonight, saying a bunch of insiders, Obama, Hillary and Kaine, don't let Obama have a third term. She knows that was coming at her. She knows that a lot of progressives won't like him because of his position supporting NAFTA and supporting free trade agreements, and so that makes him unpopular but in the end, as Jeff was saying, she understands that this is a decision about if you are elected how you would govern and this is the person you have to live with every single day and in many ways, depend on every single day.
[21:05:21] COOPER: Dana, does it hurt Clinton with Sanders supporters?
DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: It certainly could but clearly, the Clinton team, which is as you mentioned earlier, very data driven, believes that they have a potentially bigger problem or maybe the flipside of that, a bigger prize in picking somebody like Tim Kaine, who was much more moderate as Gloria talked about on issues like trade, even some social issues, but that could help her in reaching out to not just independents but republicans who are disillusioned with the Trump candidacy and are looking for somewhere else to go.
So it's that, but there's also something that you can't underestimate, Anderson, which is the map. Not only is he from Virginia and very, very popular there, which is an important state, that she wants to kind of obviously put in her corner. They are in Florida, going to Florida, having a big event there tomorrow. That is a crucial, crucial state.
So with Virginia and Florida, the map is much, much harder for Donald Trump to win with other states, even with, you know, never mind Ohio but Pennsylvania and others, he would have to get a whole bunch of states that are kind of toss-ups in his corner.
So there's the politics but also, the thing I think we need to keep in mind is that this is also Hillary Clinton doubling down on pick us, we can govern. We're a solid team. I'm sure she's going to say something along these lines. Yes, they're insiders but the flipside of being an insider is somebody with experience and a team with experience. And that is her main message already against Donald Trump and this just kind of amplifies it.
COOPER: All right, Dana, Gloria, just stay with us. I want to bring back the rest of our political panel, Christine Quinn, Tara Setmayer, Scottie Nell Hughes and Alex Burns. Christine, you are a Clinton supporter. Are you happy with this choice?
CHRISTINE QUINN, CLINTON SUPPORTER: I'm very happy with this choice. First I'm most happy with this choice because I really think it was a Hillary's choice. I think this is the person she wanted.
COOPER: She is the person she's most comfortable with.
QUINN: Yeah, without a doubt and I think you can even see that when they're onstage together. She really looks like she's having fun. So that's the most important thing. Second, I'm very happy with the choice because he's somebody who has been there on the issues that I and so many democrats care deeply about on gun control, on LGBT rights, on women's right to choose. He's someone who's always been in the right place and such a stark contrast to Pence on the Republican side, who has been in all of the wrong places.
COOPER: Even though I mean he's (picking) against abortion though purpose -- with his voting record, right.
QUINN: But his voting record is perfect and you know, you - that's an important thing to hear a person say, that he has his personal opinion but he understands the distinction between your personal opinion and what the law should be that affects others.
COOPER: And to Sanders supporters who say they wanted more of a Sanders or an Elizabeth Warren, what do you say?
QUINN: You know, there's been a lot of conversation throughout the whole primary season and post primary season about will Hillary get the Bernie supporters. All of the polling shows that we've gotten almost all of the Bernie supporters. And part of that was because in the platform process, Secretary Clinton and her campaign were very respectful, consulted with the Senator, brought his people in and I have no doubt that we're going to come out of this campaign more united because the substance is there.
COOPER: And Alex, you know, and there are a lot of people who when they hear a politician say, look, this is about governing and this is the person who can step in, Donald Trump sort of mocked that answer, saying that's what politicians always say. Do you think this really was about governing, or is this about politics?
ALEX BURNS, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I think it's about both. And I think in a lot of ways, governing is the political message here, that if you are Hillary Clinton, clearly you've made the choice really, you're never going to be able to get away from the fact that you are a career politician, a Washington insider who has been in public life for 30 years. So what you need to do with the vice presidential choice is try to and persuade voters to see that experience a little bit differently, to see it as a reflection of seriousness and sort of sobriety in government as opposed to reflection of being sort out of touch and insular. And we'll see whether Kaine can deliver that message how he explicitly delivers that message tomorrow.
COOPER: Scottie that it's certainly something Donald Trump is going harp on minority?
SCOTTIE NELL HUGHES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Oh, exactly that we have already seen it's an outside establishment year, that's why Bernie Sanders was so popular, so she picked somebody that's just like her. And I have this real question about comfort. I can tell you as a Trump supporter, I'm very happy with Kaine pick because I think this is actually -- this makes it a very easy argument to say why you needed Trump/Pence. I was more concerned about a Cory Booker who is very energetic, he would actually balance and be -- make that ticket very diversified or you actually look at Julian Castro. We talk about here you've got Kaine can speak Spanish, Castro is Hispanic, so if that's the way you are going to try to get that vote ...
COOPER: He doesn't actually speak Spanish.
QUINN: No, he doesn't.
[21:10:01] HUGHES: But he's actually Hispanic, I don't, I think, it takes more like -- she's actually some of that, one of that he actually does, you know.
QUINN: But we kind to win on the diversity of the ticket thing.
HUGHES: Why but it's about is ...
QUINN: Hillary Clinton that first woman I think.
HUGHES: Let's just -- it's -- there was more than that though. It's all about being these are politicians, their status quo politicians...
QUINN: We definitely win.
HUGHES: .. more of the same, just because you have...
COOPER: Tara, you're not -- you are a conservative, you're not a Trump supporter.
TARA SETMAYER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Right.
COOPER: Do you think she -- it's too safe a choice?
SETMAYER: I think it remains to be seen because this election has become such a cult of personality election and even this discussion just now, about who she's -- you know, the Cory Booker or Julian Castro and all that, that was more of an entertainment pick because neither one of those, you know, are ready to be president of the United States where Alex made the point that when you're -- this should be about governing. This -- the people should make the decisions on who they're voting for based on who best is best suited to run this country.
So not, you know, who fits a certain, checks a certain box. And that the republicans are guilty of that, too, with certain picks. But democrats though, you know, would do that also. But it's - I just don't think that that's what this should be about. I think when people look at someone, they need and look at the ticket, they need to look at who is best suited to run the country.
Right now, when you see what Donald Trump does, there are many people like myself who think that he is completely ill equipped to run the country, where you look at a Mike Pence and you go, well, at least if anything happened we know Mike Pence is capable. But this is where I think that middle, the people who are undecided, they're going to say OK, do we want a show which is what we get every time Donald Trump comes out, or are we going to get or we going to -- or do we want something that's a little bit more measured. And I think that's going to be the ultimate question here, but emotion has really driven this election, a lot.
HUGHES: But if our country was being run successfully, I think, Tara, you'd have a phenomenal point. But our country is not being run successfully. We have lots of bureaucracy, we're $19 trillion in debt. We have an issue with security. We are seeing low job growth. We have a problem in this country that both sides can agree with them.
SETMAYER: And you have an amateur on the other side you has met (inaudible) who has never doesn't know a thing about how to run the government.
HUGHES: And also, but he also has also created 30, 000 jobs.
COOPER: And so (inaudible) for now, we're going to have a break, just had two political professionals and a lot of insight experience and moments like this, David Axelrod and Dan Pfeiffer joining us to talk about her pick.
Also, late details from Munich where a lone gunman is dead in. Sadly, so are nine others. Details ahead.
[21:15:52]COOPER: A late and very big news tonight, on the campaign trail. Virginia's Tim Kaine is now Hillary Clinton's running mate. We'll hear from the two tomorrow morning, their first joint appearance together. Once now that the announcement has been made.
The first senior political commentator and Former Obama Senior Adviser David Axelrod, host of the CNN Podcast, "The Axe Files" and another former senior adviser to President Obama, CNN political commentator, Dan Pfeiffer. So David, Tim Kaine, what does he get, Secretary Clinton, I mean, is it all about Virginia, winning Virginia?
DAVID AXELROD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think that that is only a small part of it. I honestly don't believe vice presidential candidates deliver states. I think Lyndon Johnson was the last one who actually did when he delivered Texas for John F. Kennedy in 1960. But what he does give her is someone who is stable, reliable, someone who won't make mistakes and someone who is clearly qualified for the office.
And remember, what she's selling right now is stability, reliability, temperament in contrast to Donald Trump. So Tim Kaine makes a lot of sense and then there's one other thing that he delivers and that's why the announcement is going to happen in Miami tomorrow. He was a Jesuit missionary in Honduras. He's fluent in Spanish. And you will see that I'm sure on display tomorrow because Florida's the great blocking state for Hillary Clinton. If Donald Trump can't dislodge her there, very unlikely he can win the presidency.
COOPER: Dan, do you agree with that, with David assessment that is not -- I mean that Virginia is only one part of the puzzle?
DAN PFEIFFER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yeah, I think Virginia's only one part. I think politics is only one part. And you need somebody who crosses that threshold who will be an able campaigner, not make a mistake but ultimately you're picking someone that you are going to have to govern with for the next 48 years. It has to be someone you like and you trust and I think from everything I have read and seen, that they have built a relationship and ...
COOPER: But there's a lot of people who just don't buy that, who say look, come on, this is all about getting elected and the other stuff comes later. You really think that the Secretary Clinton...
AXELROD: Yeah but those...
COOPER: Go ahead.
AXELROD: Anderson, those people haven't worked in the White House. Hillary Clinton has had the experience of having been in the White House for eight years when her husband was president, having been there as secretary of state and she understands how important that dynamic is between the vice president and the president, and I don't think she wants to saddle herself with someone who might be helpful for the next four months and unhelpful for the next four or eight years. One other thing that we should mention is as there are events overseas again. Tim Kaine not only has been a mayor of a very diverse city and governor of a swing state, but he also is the United States senator who serves on both the foreign relations committee and the armed services committee, and is very fluent in national security issues, which is going to be increasingly important apparently in this election.
COOPER: Dan, when Donald Trump picked Governor Pence as his running mate, do you think that gave Secretary Clinton an even bigger chance of picking Senator Kaine? I mean if he had picked somebody or Newt Gingrich, somebody was more of the, you know an attack dog, something like that, that might have changed her thinking?
PFEIFFER: I think if I may gave a little bit more permission to do so in the sense that Mike Pence versus Tim Kaine in a debate, it seems like a more natural thing than, you know, at Newt Gingrich, for instance, who is a bomb thrower but, you know, I'd like to go to your earlier question, that I think this is a governing pick. I could make a better political case for Cory Booker, Tom Perez, Sherrod Brown, Elizabeth Warren than I could for Tim Kaine, I think it's a fine -- I think he is a fine pick politically but he - I think she's clearly making a choice about who she wants to govern with and who she can trust.
COOPER: Was there a need, Dan, I mean, you know, some people perhaps wanted what they considered to be more exciting choice, I guess on Elizabeth Warren, maybe a Cory Booker. I assume given the amount of data that the Clinton campaign probably looks at, that they feel pretty good about the liberal side of the Democratic Party.
PFEIFFER: Yeah. I think that they, I think they have looked at this in every which way they can and should, and that this Donald Trump's going to take care of the excitement problem for Hillary Clinton. That she doesn't need to do that with he VP pick. [21:20:05] COOPER: And David, I got to to ask you about these, these
leaked e-mails from the DNC, showing that the DNC was sending e-mails, raising questions about Bernie Sanders' religion and trying to hope people would ask questions about that, to see how that would play in a state like Kentucky and elsewhere. What do you make of that, of the DNC? I mean, it seems like, you know, on the first look kind of plotting against Bernie sanders.
AXELROD: I'm sure it will go over very well with the Sanders supporters. Look, they already have put a big target on Debbie Wassermann Schultz's for this perceived tilt in favor of Hillary Clinton. What you hear from Sanders supporters is yeah, they may not be happy with Tim Kaine, but the thing they really want is someone else to chair this democratic convention because they are so furious at what they see as bias on the part of the democratic national committee throughout this campaign. And this obviously is going to throw another log on the fire.
COOPER: Yeah. I mean, Dan, the DNC just as with the GOP and they're supposed to be remaining neutral until a candidate is selected.
PFEIFFER: Right. I think that this is certainly unhelpful, particularly at a time when we've seen the Sanders and Clinton camps come together. Bernie Sanders endorsing, him responding to Donald Trump via Twitter during that speech. So I think this is going to give more fodder for those who want to try to sow division. I think ultimately if that can make a huge bit of a difference come November.
COOPER: Dan Pfeiffer, David Axelrod, thanks very much.
One quick program note. Tomorrow morning, Wolf Blitzer anchors Hillary Clinton, Tim Kaine's joint appearance. Coverage begins at 11:30 eastern time, 11:30 a.m.
Up next tonight, our other breaking story. An update on the deadly mass shooting in Munich, what police know about the gunman right now.
[21:25:45] COOPER: Today begins tomorrow in Munich, Germany with perhaps a small sense of relief. There were early reports of as many as three gunmen on the loose turned out not to be true. It also begins with heartache as what a single gunman did at a McDonald's and a mall was terrible enough.
When the shooting was over, 10 people were dead including the killer.
Joining us from Munich with all one of our own CNN's Erin McLaughlin. So what do we know about this killer?
ERIN MCLAUGHLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Anderson, police have yet to release his name, but what we do know is that he was 18 years old. He was a dual German and Iranian citizen. They believe that he acted alone. He was not known to police, no prior criminal record.
They also believe that in the end, he committed suicide. His body was found at around 8:00 local time, hours after the shooting not far away from the mall where he unleashed this horrific wave of terror. What police don't know at this point is why he did this. What were his motives? That is what they're trying to establish as we speak, Anderson.
COOPER: There was one witness who was on CNN who said that she heard him say Allahu Akbar, but then there's this other videotape in which he's seemed basically mentally deranged. He talking about derogatory references to Turkish people, saying he lived in Germany in the Turkish neighborhood, in the poor neighborhood. But he's also got dual citizenship, Germany and Iran. Predominantly, Iran is -- is she a Muslim which have not or usually linked to ISIS. So, what do we know about -- I mean, are there any reports of links to a larger group?
MCLAUGHLIN: Not at this point, Anderson. That is something that they are going to no doubt be looking very carefully at and as you just described there, what ensued in the wake of this attack was just extreme chaos. Different reports, different eyewitness statements. Initially eyewitnesses had told police that there were up to three attackers and in that press conference, police say that they tracked down two individuals that they thought may have escaped from the scene via vehicle and they were able to rule those individuals out at the end.
We also know that there were these false reports of shootings elsewhere in Munich. So it really gives you a sense of the chaos and the panic that unfolded there. And as I said, in that press conference, police say they do not know the motive of this attacker. They also do not know if he had planned this attack alone, though he acted alone is what they believe.
COOPER: What do we know about how the attack unfolded, so we saw the video of him shooting outside the McDonald's? There's also video of him on the roof of a parking garage. How did it unfold?
MCLAUGHLIN: Well, in that press conference police say that it began at a McDonald's at around 5:50 p.m. local time. Shots rang out, witnesses described fleeing the scene and then it moved inside the mall and that's where they say most of the casualties occurred. 10 people dead, including the gunman. 21 individuals shot and injured, many critically, including, Anderson, children.
They do not know at this point how he managed to escape, how he managed to get away, very much part of the investigation right now.
COOPER: All right. Erin McLaughlin. Erin thanks very much.
Back with our terrorism and national security panel, Paul Cruickshank, Juliette Kayyem, Retired General Mark Hertling involved there. So Paul, the fact the police said the man who killed himself in the shootings was the only gunman, does that make you believe it was something other than ISIS inspired and also the Iranian background?
PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Yeah. I mean, and the fact that in the video from the roof, he appears to be mentally deranged, ranting about all sorts of things and shooting erratically from the roof. But the fact that he committed suicide apparently from a self- inflicted gunshot suggested he was not animated by Jihadi ideology. There's a very strong prohibition in Jihadi ideology and theology against taking one's own life.
[21:30:16] Suicide bombings are allowed because that's seen as the byproduct of an attack, but suicide not allowed. And so, they would feel that they would go to hell rather than heaven if they committed suicide. So that makes me think probably not a Jihadi link here and also the fact as you point out, Anderson, that he's Iranian.
Most Iranians are Shia Muslims. So there have in Germany, it has to be said, being some Shia Iranians who have converted to Sunni Islam and actually gone off to Pakistan and joined Al Qaeda, but those have been very rare those kinds of cases. I think there was some thought earlier that there might be some right wing extremism link because of the five year anniversary of that horrific attack. I think the fact he's a German-Iranian national sort of takes us away from that hypothesis as well.
COOPER: Right. That attack was in Norway five years ago in this day. Bob, I mean, at this point, what stands out to you?
ROBERT BAER, CNN INTELLIGENCE AND SECURITY ANALYST: Well, yeah, it's exactly what Paul said. I don't think this is a terrorist attack. The man was deranged. The Shia community in Germany is politically inactive. They have been for 30 years and just none of it makes any sense. And the fact there weren't multiple shooters which originally suggested it was the Islamic State. I think this man was just deranged.
But what I have to ask is where did he get the gun? It's very difficult to get in Germany. And it's very worrisome that there are so many arms floating around Europe. It did not used to be the case. So whether these people are terrorists, lone wolves, whatever they are, the fact that they have access to guns will be very -- it's very bad for Europe.
COOPER: Mark, how much do we know? I mean, German intelligence obviously, I mean Munich is one of the places that a lot of refugees have come to. I was in Munich last year for Oktoberfest, following groups of refugees who were coming in from Greece, ultimately from Syria. How much of a handle do the intelligence forces, the military forces and police forces in Germany have on who's in their country now?
LT. GEN. MARK HERTLING (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: It's tough, Anderson. I was in Germany about a month ago and talked to some former friends of mine who are in the government and they were saying that each one of the states, the 16 states in Germany, handle their immigrants and refugees differently. They've been handed a group of individuals by the federal government and said here's your refugees, take care of them.
Some of the states clump them all together in what we would call ghettos. Others try and spread them out into the population. They don't have a very good feel for how they're meeting as groups and what they're doing. But to go to what Bob just said too in terms of the weapons flow, a lot of the weapons are coming across from the former -- from the Balkan states in terms of gun running and gun trade.
It was one of the things I saw, not only human trafficking, but also arms trafficking in Europe. And what we were trying to do is as U.S. forces in Europe is help the Germany government prevent that. So, all of these problems are things that the Germans are facing within the last five to 10 years. They are very challenging. The culture has changed in Germany. The government is changing and the people's view of some of these things are certainly changing.
And, you know again, the other thing that I would suggest in this whole action was the reporting that took place. Was there one shooter? Was there three? One guy reported this guy yelled Allahu Akbar which is something that Shia also proclaimed. Another one said that he said in a Bavarian accent, I'm a German. All of these things were very confusing and I'm sure really put the federal police and local police in a real cheetah flip as they were trying to deal with what's going on.
COOPER: Yeah. Juliette, I mean, time and time again we have seen these, these initial reports where often it says there are multiple shooters, multiple people involved and a lot of times it's just eyewitnesses seeing the same thing, but from different angles are getting confused.
JULIETTE KAYYEM, FORMER U.S. ASST. SECY. FOR HOMELAND SECURITY: That's exactly right. Eyewitness reporting especially in the middle of the situation is inherently unreliable because though they're just seeing it from an individual viewpoint. So, in almost all these attacks, even Orlando, remember, we thought in those first couple hours it was multiple shooters in the bar. And so the situational awareness was very difficult for the German officials.
I will say, however, this was a test run. It is likely not related to the international terrorism that this panel generally is on about. But in terms of the response, you know, trying to sort of fortify and evacuate the shopping mall, closing down mass transit which is absolutely important during any of these major or even, you know sort of individual incidents. And I have to, you know, commend Munich for its communication, even though at the moment it was wrong, they were at least communicating to the public to stay put.
[21:35:00] COOPER: Right.
KAYYEM: That's essential for the public to know what's going on.
COOPER: Well, I want to thank everybody on our panel.
Just ahead, reaction to Donald Trump's convention speech from President Obama, saying the President offered something of a fact check for the numbers Trump threw out about crime and immigration. He's not alone in questioning the data. Tom Foreman also a reality check is next.
COOPER: As if there weren't enough of it already, there's more breaking news tonight. The answer perhaps to the longest -- to the long-standing mystery of what happened to Malaysia Airlines Flight 370.
We are just getting this in. It centers on the 777's captain and the flight simulation program he ran as a hobby.
According to New York Magazine's Jeff Wise, an FBI forensic examination shows that the captain used the program, Microsoft Flight Simulator X to fly essentially a suicide route.
Joining us by phone is CNN Aviation Correspondent Richard Quest. So first of all, where did this information come from? What are the key points and what do you make of it?
RICHARD QUEST, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: Well, first of all, when the Malaysian authorities took away the flight simulator, it was sent to the FBI to decode it, because the FBI has a special experience and knowledge.
We've always known, that there was this rumor out there that the FBI had found that he had practiced, Captain Zaharie, who was the captain, that he had practiced flying suicide routes or routes down into the Southern Indian Ocean.
[21:40:12] Anderson, this rumor has been around for a long time, pretty much from the very get-go. However, the FBI sometimes lead that this was denied and it could never stand up. Now it seems Jeff Wise in New York magazine has stood it up and they've seen the document that actually outlines the route that the captain flew, practicing, if you like, for what was going to happen just a month later.
COOPER: Now Richard, we're showing on screen ...
COOPER: ... what is the two routes. The yellow is the actual route that the plane took. The red is the simulated route that the captain practiced and you can see the similarities obviously, basically making that turn and then heading to a point where I guess it would run out of fuel in the ocean.
QUEST: And if you look at those two things, the only difference between the two is the initial departure toward Beijing where it goes up and turns round. But if you look at the route, it does go up straight to Malacca. It goes round the tip of Indonesia and then starts a long journey down to the Southern Indian Ocean.
Now, Anderson, this is -- what do I make of it? It is everything and it is nothing. It is the clearest circumstantial evidence that Zaharie was involved in stealing his own plane or hijacking his own plane and flying it on a suicide mission. But it does not prove it in any shape or form. It is purely the sort of circumstantial evidence that is still tough over time.
And then, with that in mind, and what is very interesting against the Malaysian is that they've known about this and they didn't release it. They've never remarked upon it. And they didn't even put it in their first report one year after the event.
COOPER: Yeah, I mean, that raises all sorts of questions. I mean, they put out what was supposed to be sort of this definitive report, I think one year after and there was no mention of this.
QUEST: Not only was there no mention of this, Anderson. They actually said that the captain handled pressure well, there was nothing happening in his personal life and that there was no reason to believe there was anything amiss. They actually in that report went the other way and gave him a clean bill of health when by then, they must have known there was this potentially circumstantial evidence which even if not linked, even if not directly connected, surely should have been mentioned. So you're left with this very weird scenario where once again, the focus of attention is on Captain Ahmad Shah Zaharie, a 30 year age -- a 30 veteran captain, 16 years Senior Captain, but you're left wondering what does it tell us? And the truth is it adds suspicion but no proof.
COOPER: And I guess there's two other ways. So, one is if a pilot were in fact planning this, would he or she really need to simulate it, and also, if a pilot was planning this, would they really need to just fly that long and then run out as opposed to just bringing the plane down into the water?
QUEST: And I can tell you what you have elegantly put your finger on is the subject of comment between myself and all our other CNN aviation analysts that we're going backwards and forward saying what does it prove, if anything. Look, he could have easily just got a map out and a few some and worked out where the plane would have been. Why do it -- and the other thing is of course, as people are pointing out, he would have had to sit through the entire simulation unless he ran it fast forward. And then there's the question of was it deleted from the simulator or was it merely overwritten.
Again, we come to this point. We've known the rumor of its existence. What we now seem to have and we will need confirmation from either the FBI or the Malaysians, and there will be fat chance of that, I'm guessing, is that it is actually accurate and it is confirmed. That's the least the families can expect at this stage.
COOPER: I suppose another scenario is that this is just a captain who had been flying for a long time who wanted to simulate a, you know, wanted to simulate a variety of different kinds of flights. I'm not sure this would be -- if that's a viable explanation as well, but I'm just raising.
QUEST: It is. It is. When we were discussing this earlier amongst ourselves, Miles O'Brien pointed out, yes when you're using flight simulators, you do interesting things with them. You don't just sit them for seven hours on the cruise and blue sky. And so I can see that particular angle as well. [21:45:05] Now, the truth is, this is a very interesting serious development that casts shadow of suspicion over the captain and needs to be answered. Unfortunately, it will not help us understand where the plane is.
Let me be absolutely clear about this, Anderson. Everybody knows roughly the place where it is. It's off the Western Coast of Australia. This map that you're showing bears that out. The problem is we're still left with those satellite bits of data as to where to get it and there's one other development in the last 24 hours which has got slightly lost in all of this. The Malaysians, the Australians ...
QUEST: ... and the Chinese have decided that they will suspend the search operations after they've searched the current zone because they simply haven't got enough data to narrow it down anywhere else.
COOPER: All right. Richard Quest, we'll continue to follow this. Thanks very much.
Up next, back to politics. What undecided voters thought of Donald Trump's message last night? Did he gain new supporter? What Randi Kaye discovers when we continue?
[21:50:00] COOPER: Plenty of strong reaction today to Donald Trump's convention speech including from President Obama who threw shade on Trump's dark portrait of the country. The President said his number on everything from crime to immigration are wrong. Tom Foreman has a reality check.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: The crime and violence that today afflicts our nation will soon, and I mean, very soon come to an end.
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Donald Trump insisting he will restore safety to a nation under siege.
TRUMP: Homicides last year increased by 17 percent in America's 50 largest cities. That's the largest increase in 25 years. In the president's hometown of Chicago, more than 2000 people have been the victim of shootings this year alone.
FOREMAN: The Washington Post analyzed crime data for 50 major cities and found that 770 more people were killed in 2015 than the year before, a 17 percent jump, the biggest since 1990. And more than 2000 people have been shot in Chicago this year. So Trump's first claim is true. But hold on.
PRES. BARACK OBAMA, UNITED STATES: I think it is important just to be absolutely clear here, that some of the fears that were expressed throughout the week just don't jibe with the facts.
FOREMAN: In fact, FBI data shows even with the recent surge in homicides, violent crime overall started steadily falling in the mid- 90s and has kept going down, dropping 15 percent between 2009 and 2014, the latest year with complete numbers.
OBAMA: The fact of the matter is, is that the murder rate today, the violence rate today, is far lower than it was when Ronald Reagan was president, and lower than when I took office.
FOREMAN: The President's claim is also true. So ...
JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: How can the Republicans make the argument that somehow it's more dangerous today when the facts don't back that up?
PAUL MANAFORT, TRUMP CAMPAIGN CHAIRMAN: People don't feel safe in their neighborhoods. I'm not sure what statistics you're talking about. But I know for a fact anything we say ...
TAPPER: FBI statistics.
MANAFORT: Well, the FBI is certainly suspect these days after what they just did with Hillary Clinton.
FOREMAN: And what about crime committed by undocumented immigrants? Trump correctly notes illegal entries by families have spiked in year. And when those families are caught ...
TRUMP: They are being released by the tens of thousands into our communities with no regard for the impact on public safety or resources.
FOREMAN: But Homeland Security says that's just not happening. Trump's claim is false.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOREMAN: You can see the problem here. Each side in this debate has some evidence to back its claims. But if you don't think of it all at once, it's easy to get a false impression. The most we can accurately say is that violent crime in this country has been declining for quite some time and now it is moving up a bit. Anderson?
COOPER: Tom, thanks very much.
About 32 million people watched last night, not a (inaudible) beat record. Eight years ago, John McCain earned that title with about 7 million more. Still a lot of voters did tune in. The question is, did Donald Trump earn new supporters? Here's what Randi Kaye discovered.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I humbly and gratefully accept your nomination for the presidency of the United States. RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: In the swing state of Florida where every vote counts, these voters are still undecided.
BRYAN CAMARENO, UNDECIDED REPUBLICAN VOTER: I thought it was great, inspiring, motivating, but still, I left -- I was left with how are we going to accomplish all this.
KAYE: They gathered at this watch party in Tampa for Donald Trump's speech, hoping it would help them decide how to vote. For most, the speech left them wanting more.
KIMBERLY KELLY, UNDECIDED VOTER: I think he needs to start getting more specific as he moves down the road for me to say I'll punch that ticket for Donald Trump.
KAYE: As one voter put it, Trump sounded like a Mr. Fix-It even when it came to improving education and infrastructure.
MICHAEL BEARD, UNDECIDED VOTER: He started that entire segment by saying he's going to create the largest tax cuts in history. Well, then how are you going to pay for all that investment in education and infrastructure?
KAYE: And when Trump said this ...
TRUMP: I am the law and order candidate.
KAYE: ... it was a turnoff for some.
Why does that scare you?
CAMARENO: Because it sounds like police state. When he said, I was like, "Oh, you know, how are you going to enforce it? Is it going to be a military state, curfews?" I mean, what are we talking about? So that did scare me.
KAYE: But this voter did like Trump's tough talk on strengthening law and order.
GABRIELA RYAN, UNDECIDED VOTER: I carry a gun everywhere. I've never worried about minorities, I've never worried about police violence until very recently. So, I don't think that we realistically have to worry about a police state from Donald Trump.
KAYE: Unlike some critics, this group didn't find Trump's speech scary or full of doom and gloom. They took comfort in his promise to keep America safe.
[21:55:02] JAMEY KETLER, FLORIDA VOTER: Our police are under attack. Our military budget has been slashed. Ask any service member out there, I mean, it's devastating.
KAYE: He did seem to stick to the themes that have worked for him.
KAYE: Did that work for all of you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No.
TRUMP: I alone can fix it.
KAYE: Lacking in the speech for these voters, a sense of Donald Trump's upbringing, more personal stories and his softer side, though one voter did see a twinkle of modesty.
You say you saw humility in this speech. How so?
RYAN: It's nice to see that humble father talking about his children and his pride rather than what he can do for everybody and how powerful he is. So that was refreshing.
TRUMP: And goodnight.
KAYE: When the speech was done, most in this group felt they could picture President Trump in the Oval Office.
Did you feel like watching his speech, did you feel like you trusted Donald Trump?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'll give him that much. I feel like I can trust him.
KAYE: Yes, yes?
WILL CRABTREE, UNDECIDED VOTER: I will give him that I think he is less full of gas than I did previously.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I thought that.
KAYE: But on one voter actually decided on a candidate. Did Donald Trump win your vote with this speech?
KETLER: Yes, he did.
KAYE: In fact, six of our eight voters said they are still strongly considering staying home on Election Day. Randi Kaye, CNN, Tampa, Florida.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Interesting. We'll be right back.
[23:00:06] COOPER: And that does it for us. Thanks for watching. "CNN Tonight" with Don Lemon starts now.