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Hillary Clinton Makes History in Philadelphia; Bill Clinton Takes Stage in Supporting Role; Clinton's Likability Factor; Comparing and Contrasting the Republican Convention and Democratic Convention. Aired 1-2a ET

Aired July 27, 2016 - 01:00   ET



[01:00:15] DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: And it is official. Hillary Clinton making history right here in Philadelphia. As Bill Clinton takes to the stage in a supporting role.

This is a special CNN TONIGHT. I'm Don Lemon. We're live at the CNN Grill at the Democratic Convention. And boy, it is jumping here tonight.

For the first time in over two centuries, a woman, Hillary Clinton, is the presidential nominee of a major party. Her husband who is, by the way, the 42nd president of the United States, laying out the case for her tonight with a 42-minute speech that was pure Bill Clinton.

It was folksy, impassioned, full of stories about their life together. And whipping up the cheering crowd as no one else could. Here to discuss all of it is my political dream team, David Chalian to my right, Peter Beinart to my left, Kayleigh McEnany to my left but she's on the right. Angela Rye is here, she's on the left and Maria Cardona is here as well. It looks like the boys versus the girls, right?



MCENANY: Let's get it.

LEMON: Is this girl rocking or what?


LEMON: You probably can't hear the music at home, but the music is really loud. People are dancing.


LEMON: They're drinking and they're eating. One of the big moments of the night was that glass ceiling moment. Let's watch it and get your reaction.



HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEEIAN: If there are any little girls out there who stayed up late to watch, let me just say, I may become the first woman president, but one of you is next. Thank you all. I can't wait to join you in Philadelphia. Thank you.


LEMON: Maria Cardona, how do you really feel about that?

CARDONA: Oh my god, Don. And can I just tell you, my daughter was watching.

LEMON: Yeah.

CARDONA: Because she knew that this was going to happen tonight. She was so excited and she was watching that moment. So when she said these words, and when you saw the glass ceiling and when said one of you could be next, I lost it. I literally did. But I don't think I was the only one. I think everybody in this country, I think regardless of politics whether you like her or not, had to at least feel the moment and what it meant for America, for women, for families, for our children. Not just our girls. For our boys and our girls who now like people have been saying can take for granted that a woman can be president.

LEMON: Angela Rye?

ANGELA RYE, CNN POLITICLA COMMENTATOR: I love that moment, but I -- we're probably going to get to it later. I loved Bill Clinton tonight ...

LEMON: We're going to get to Bill. I just want to ...


LEMON: But we're going to get to the former president, but what did you think of that moment?

RYE: (Inaudible) government. But yes, I can't wait to talk about it. I loved that moment. It is so historic. It's a great moment for their family. It's a great moment, like Maria said, for little girls and grown women watching men and women cry on the floor tonight. It was a huge deal.

LEMON: Kayleigh, I know there's bigger issues on just woman's issue for me. But just for that moment as a woman, did you relate to that?

MCENANY: I congratulate her on this big achievement. It's historical. She has this forever. She deserves to be commended for it. But I think Newt Gingrich asked the right question, do we have a woman? Is this the right woman? And I think for half of the country, by 5percent in the latest poll, the answer is no.

PETER BEINART, CNN POLITICLA COMMENTATOR: OK. But these are separate questions. MCENANY: Yeah.

BEINART: I don't begrudge the fact that people disagree with Hillary Clinton ideologically. Of course, we can have that argument. But I think it's reasonable to have at least one moment where we say regardless of what you think of her politics, this is a massive fundamental cultural moral change that has an impact on every single American. I, too, have an eight-year-old daughter. But I thought was her horizons will be different than the horizons that my sister had when she was eight because of that, that has nothing to do ...


LEMON: ... woman, you would feel the same way?

BEINART: I mean I'm not a conservative woman on two counts. So I ...

LEMON: I said, even if it was ...

BEINART: Yes, I think I would say I ...


BEINART: I oppose that, but I recognize that culturally as opposed to politically, culturally something important is happening.

MCENANY: Absolutely.

LEMON: David Chalian?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: You know, I agree with Maria. What she was saying is that politics aside -- let's just put the politics aside entirely. One of Hillary Clinton's campaign aides described that last moment as, you know, the ruler that everybody get in school with the picture of every president ...


CHALIAN: And they're going through all those portraits. And, you know, I got into this business of journalism because I want to bear witness to history. Those are -- That's sort of the calling to tell these stories. And so to have that ruler ingrained in my head and all those portraits and then see that last portrait come up the way it is, it's like, wow, this is a moment of history. One that should be marked totally apart, obviously there's a divided country ...

[01:05:08] MCENANY: That's exactly right. And I think it's important to answer Peter, yes, it's a moment in history that will go down in the history books. People will read it forever more. But a lot of Americans woke up today with a lot of different concerns on their head like a priest who slaughter during mass in Normandy, it was the number one trend on Twitter. A lot of people are very concerned and it's perilous times, so we can celebrate history. And we should celebrate history but can't neglect the times that we're in.

LEMON: I'd say when we have moments like this whether it's the first black, Hispanic, woman, whatever it is, whatever who is not of the majority culture, I say there's no but, there's no caveat. I say to women tonight, congratulations finally. Every little girl will now grow up and say, I, too, can possibly be president of the United States. Just like every little black kid like when Barack Obama, like me, you know? So I say no caveat, congratulations to her.

MCENANY: Perfect.

LEMON: Whether she becomes president or not. But congratulations to all women, and especially young girls around the country who see that. All right. So Bill Clinton tonight, his speech. Let's listen to part of it and then we'll discuss. Let's talk about it.


BILL CLINTON, FORMER UNITED STATES PRESIDENT: In the spring of 1971, I met a girl. The first time we saw her, we were appropriately enough in a class on political and civil rights. She had thick blond hair. Big glasses. Wore no makeup. And she exuded this sense of strength and self-possession I found magnetic. After the class I followed her out, intending to introduce myself. I got close enough to touch her back but I couldn't do it. Somehow I knew this would not be just another tap on the shoulder. And I might be starting something I couldn't stop.


MCENANY: He needs to be careful.

LEMON: All right. So first of all when he walked out, I was like, this looks like Bill Clinton 10 years ago. He looks really young. But do you think that ...

CHALIAN: Really young? But he looks ...

BEINART: Younger.

LEMON: Yeah, he did.

MCENANY: He looked healthy.

LEMON: He looks really good.

MCENANY: He looked healthy.

LEMON: I thought he looked good. Did he make her more relatable you think tonight?

CHALIAN: Yeah, I think -- Listen, obviously, nobody on earth knows Hillary Clinton better than Bill Clinton. So, he has a truly unique perspective to be able to sort of

take us through her biography. I don't think that those were his most passionate and animated moments of his speech. I actually think where you saw real Bill -- real classic Bill Clinton, that's when he was connecting it to policy.


CHALIAN: Because, you know, that's the stuff he really cares about. I think he went through the biography to sort of check the box of what the campaign needs to do which is, you know, say to the country, I know you think you know this woman, you've seen her for 25 years on the public stage. You probably do, but let me make sure I fill out that picture for you and give you this broader sense. So, I think he does good. I think there's no way -- Remember, the folks tuning into this convention tonight, largely a Democratic audience, they love Bill Clinton. And so, hearing him testify for his wife in that way will no doubt do her good.

LEMON: OK. So here's -- I thought it was brilliant in that because I do -- wow, it's really slow. You know, they were texting me, I said, it plays differently when you're in the hall than it is on television. They gave us (inaudible) and then, "boom!", right? Let's play the part -- what's the part that we have where -- you think you don't know the real one? Here's the fake one and here's the real one. Can you play that?


B. CLINTON: Now, how did this square with the things you heard at the Republican Convention? What's the difference in what I told you and what they said? How do you square it? You can't. One is real, the other is made up. And you just have to decide which is which, my fellow Americans. The real one had done more positive change-making before she was 30 than many public officials do in a lifetime in office. The real one -- The real one if you saw her friend Betsy Ebeling vote for Illinois today has friends from childhood, through Arkansas, where she has not lived in more than 20 years who have gone all across America at their own expense, to fight for the person they know.

[01:10:12] The real one has earned the loyalty to respect and the fervent support of people who have worked with her in every stage of her life including leaders around the world who know her to be able, straightforward, and completely trustworthy. The real one calls you when you're sick, when your kid's in trouble or when there's a death in the family. The real one repeatedly drew praise from prominent Republicans when she was a senator and secretary of state.


LEMON: So Kayleigh, he's saying her record is so exemplary, her history is so fascinating, she's done so much work that her opponent can't help but make up another person because basically ...

MCENANY: I think her record speaks for itself.

LEMON: That's what he's saying as well.

MCENANY: Yeah, when you look across the Middle East and it's on fire, I don't think Americans feel very secure right now. But, you know, I agree with him in the sense that he's trying to posit that there are two very different pictures being painted of Hillary Clinton and, you know, the moods of the two conventions and only one can be true. And I believe that the viewers, voters asked him, "How do you feel right now? Do you feel safe in your home? Do you feel your wages keeping pace with your buying power, your purchasing power?" And I think those voters ...

LEMON: But can you blame that on Hillary Clinton?

MCENANY: No, I think you can to a large extent. Yes, she's endorsed the Obama policies and she wants to be the next term. She was asked by Bret Baier, "How would you be different from Obama and the economy?" She said, well, I put more green jobs out there. That's not really a way to differentiate yourself from the last eight years. If she differentiated herself like Bernie Sanders did, then maybe I'd say yes, but she did not do that. She's latched on (ph).

LEMON: Peter?

BEINART: You know, I probably going to disagree a little bit with my progressive friend. But I actually didn't love the speech. And it was folksy, it appealing and sweet, no question about it. But I actually today went back and read every convention speech that Bill Clinton has given since 1988. Well, you'll realize his incredible gift has always been to define this moment in American history, to say what our particular problem is and how to move us forward. He talked beautifully about Hillary Clinton. But he did not connect, I think, her to this moment in history.

RYE: I disagree.

BEINART: He said she's a great change-maker.

LEMON: Peter, let me jump in here. Isn't that what Barack Obama is going to do on Thursday?

BEINART: Maybe, I don't know what Barack Obama -- I can't predict the future. I can only say, well, Bill Clinton, he did that so well for Barack Obama four years ago.

RYE: He had a different role.


LEMON: But he's not Barack Obama's husband.

RYE: That's right.

LEMON: He's Hillary Clinton ...


BEINART: Maybe I can come up with the same ...

RYE: We had a ...

BEINART: I know Bill Clinton can do that and he didn't. RYE: So here's the thing, Bill Clinton was everything to me because I had a different expectation. I knew that he could perform on this stage because he's done it to your point time and time again. I was scared because -- Maria might disagree with me, but he has shown out at some of these rallies and not in a good way.

CARDONA: No question about that.

RYE: That's right, that's right. And tonight what he did so effectively to me is he told this love story that made me melt that I've never felt like -- I felt like this was the relationship where they were just like, you got gold, I got gold, let's make this happen. But it was this love story that I was like, this is kind of good.

He talks about her being guarded and slowly being able to get past that guard. Same thing the country's going through right now. He goes through every state that she ever touched. And you heard those different pockets of the arena cheering because they know the impact that Hillary Clinton had on those different states. And then he goes through decade by decades the impact that she had. It was compelling to me.

What I will tell you very clearly, Hillary friends I know you're going to be mad at me, I have not been ready for Hillary. I was not ready for Bernie either, I'm not a Berner (ph) and I've been somewhere wobbling (ph) like I'm just not excited about this election. With Michelle Obama's speech yesterday and Bill Clinton's speech today, I've been like this person that they're talking about, I could go and like register for ...

CARDONA: And that was success.

RYE: Yeah.

CARDONA: So I think to your point, Peter, and you're right, Bill Clinton has had tons of other convention speeches, fantastic. He had a different goal.

RYE: Yeah.

CARDONA: It was a very different goal than all of the other convention speeches. And part of his goal was to make the world understand who Hillary Clinton was. Because it is absolutely true this is the best known woman in the world who a lot of people don't know anything about. And what he did was to try to relate a personal Hillary. A Hillary that no one else sees.

I mean, I have known these people for more than 20 years and I had heard stories tonight that I never heard before. And I think that is what he needed. And to your point about a moment in time, he absolutely talked about a moment in time. Perhaps didn't go in-depth in terms of policy, because that is going to be what the rest of the speakers are going to do, but he talked about her being the best darn change maker he has ever met.

And then to Kayleigh's point, because people are looking for some kind of change, I think that tees up to what is she going to do now? Whether it's continuing Obama's policies and how that will be good, I mean, the man is at a 56 percent approval rating and how that's going to continue to make families lives better.

[01:15:13] LEMON: I got to get to a break. On the other side of the break, we'll continue to talk about, did Bill Clinton - did he sell it? Did he make her more relatable? Did he do good?

CARDONA: Yes, yes, and yes.


LEMON: We'll be back from the Grill. The Grill is hopping tonight. Don't go anywhere.


LEMON: All right. And I'm back now with my political dream team. We're here at the CNN Grill which is still popping. Everybody is drinking but us.

MCENANY: That they know of.

LEMON: Except maybe for Angela and Maria.


LEMON: Sitting on the end, she can jump up and still grab a drink.

CARDONA: You saw me, huh?

LEMON: All right. Kayleigh, this is going to be for you, because I want to talk about more of Bill Clinton's speech and I'm going to get your reaction.


[01:20:01] B. CLINTON: For this time, Hillary is uniquely qualified to seize the opportunities and reduce the risk we faced. And she is still the best darn change-maker I have ever known. You -- You could drop her. You could drop her in any trouble spot. Pick one. Come back in a month and somehow, some way, she will have made it better. That is just who she is.

There are clear achievable, affordable responses to our challenges. But we won't get to them if America makes the wrong choice in this election. That's why you should elect her. And you should elect her because she'll never quit when the going gets tough. She will never quit on you.


LEMON: So Kayleigh, you heard him, she's the best darn change-maker in America, can't make a wrong choice. What's your response?

MCENANY: Well, the best darn change-maker, I love that we have facts like Libya in disarray, Iraq in disarray, Syria in disarray, all under the tutelage of Hillary Clinton's state department. So, if she's a change-maker, yes, it's change for the worst.

LEMON: What about the other things that he mentioned, her helping with school and adoptive parents and ...

MCENANY: Well, that's great. You know, Donald Trump has done great things in his private time, too, for veterans, all across his foundation. He's done great things, too. We've all done great things in our lives and I commend her for helping children, that's a commendable thing.

LEMON: But seriously, when you look at the laundry list of things -- No, when you look at the laundry list of things that he reeled of on her (ph), a lot of things that I didn't know, I was like, wow ...

MCENANY: Amazing.

LEMON: ... she's really done a lot

RYE: A lot. And I think there's a difference between being a change- maker and being someone who changes your mind. Like Donald Trump is someone who changes your mind, that's not someone who is creating or effectuating change. For example, you talked about wages earlier. Did you know, for example, Donald Trump now has decided that he would support a raise in minimum wage but only to 10 bucks? But then, again, I'm just going to allow the state to do it. It's like I think the type of president, the type of commander in chief I want is someone who is going to effectuate change, not someone who's going to ...

LEMON: Let's talk about that.

MCENANY: TPP, I mean, we can litigate all the things Hillary Clinton's changed her mind on the moment, 50 percent of America became in favor of those policies. She's flip-flopped more than anyone. So I wouldn't ...

RYE: I don't think you want to say more than anyone. We can look at PolitiFact and see how many times he's lied and changed his mind after ...

CARDONA: Like three or four times.

MCENANY: Or it goes back to the lie.

CHALIAN: Or change-maker becomes difficult for her is, you know, two- thirds of the country says that we're on the wrong track.

LEMON: Right.

CHALIAN: And, you know, she is clearly continuity from where we are, not just of the political establishment as we've known it because she's been in the public life for so long, but clearly continuity from the Obama administration as well. So that's why Bill Clinton had to present this as forcefully (inaudible) he did but it means it's going to be an uphill climb to make this case in the minds of Americans especially contrasted to Donald Trump who is the embodiment of change from what we're used to in our American politics.

That is going to be a tough thing for Hillary Clinton to be the change candidate. And I don't think that they can -- Right, they can't really make her the change candidate. She is not running the campaign that Al Gore ran in 2000 where he ran away from Bill Clinton. He's running with Barack Obama. They have to do what George H.W. Bush did against Michael Dukakis in '88 and what George W. Bush did against John Kerry, which is in a country (inaudible) said this change is too dangerous.

CARDONA: Yeah, exactly. That's exactly right. Yes.

CHALIAN: Now, interestingly, Bill Clinton didn't do that. He just mentioned Donald Trump the Democratic Party has to do that this week.

CARDONA: And I think that's exactly what -- the track they're going to take because I agree that people are scared, people are anxious. What Hillary Clinton has been talking about from the beginning of this campaign is that economic angst. Now, we can argue as to what Obama has done, but he is at a 56 percent approval rating right now.

So you can argue that people actually do -- and when you ask people personally, "Oh, yeah, I feel fine," the mood, though, to Kayleigh's point, is correct and we do need to do a better job of acknowledging that, but then what you focus on is what are you going to do to either continue to make families feel better about their own economic situation, and communities feel better about their own economic situation, and how are you going to do that?

LEMON: Is there a way, though, to at least influence a kind of people that she's with, the kind of working class white American that Donald Trump is so popular with? Is there any -- Because I don't think that this convention ...

MCENANY: Maybe, maybe not.

RYE: 100 percent. And here's ...

LEMON: ... reaching out to that demographic.

RYE: This is the thing I want to switch back on, and it's something that David raised, too. We can continue to lay every woe at the foot of the president -- at the feet of the president.

[01:25:06] Here's the issue. The president has continued to strive for a change in all types of huge ways and he continues to get stymied and stopped and blocked by a congress that's not cooperative on the senate side, on the house side. And I just have to say, we forget that there are policies that impact people at every level from municipalities to states. Governors, there's an overwhelming number of Republican governors, of Republican state legislators, both House and Senate. We cannot get around the fact ... LEMON: Kayleigh is shaking her head.

MCENANY: That's a massive deflection and that's ...

RYE: Oh, it's not a deflection.


MCENANY: ... talk about the record is you deflect to the municipal level, and you deflect to President Clinton.

RYE: No. Kayleigh, it's not a deflection.

LEMON: Let her make her point. Go ahead.

MCENANY: For four years, it was this is Bush's problem now it's a Congress problem. It's never take responsibility, the buck stops with the president.

RYE: I don't think that's what I said. I said you try to lay every single thing at the feet of the president. And what I'm saying to you is, as lawyers we know, right? There are laws that impact us at every level. What I'm saying is that those are majority controlled by Republican legislators.

MCENANY: If president's foreign policy has put the world, quite frankly, and certainly America in a very dangerous spot and that stops with the president ...

RYE: So that's actually a deflection.

MCENANY: That is not a deflection.

RYE: Well, then how do you explain the president's approval rating versus how people feel about policies? We have to acknowledge ...

MCENANY: People personally like the President but 73 percent of the country thinks it's going in the wrong direction.

RYE: Because of what's happening in their neighborhoods, maybe in their school and their workplace ...

LEMON: But what you're saying, Kayleigh, is that, that maybe some of that is not necessarily a reflection of the president?

MCENANY: When the president doesn't leave a stay-behind force in Iraq and it goes crazy, when he dethrones leaders in Syria, dethrones the leaders in Libya, and they go crazy and ISIS grows to 30,000 or 40,000 strong -- these are facts.

RYE: No, but it's also ...

MCENANY: The Middle East is in chaos and there's an ISIS attack. We can ignore it but every 82 hours there's an ISIS attack. In Germany, there were four this week. Three of whom were waged by refugees and this ... (CROSSTALK)

RYE: Kayleigh, people can't pay their light bills. People can't find full-time jobs because people who are on your side of the aisle cut their hours back so they don't have to pay for Obamacare or so they don't have to pay for long-term employment. Yes, they do. They don't want to pay for family medical leave like let's see for real about this.

BEINART: I think Kayleigh -- I think, actually, I think Kayleigh, you have a point which is to say that the -- and I think you saw it tonight. It is challenging for Democrats to defend Hillary Clinton's foreign policy because the Middle East is in a terrible state. There's no question about that. I happen to believe that the forces that led the Middle East to collapse have an enormous amount to do with the fact that we invaded Iraq, right, and also with the fact there were pressures building in the Middle East for generations that have not broken through.

But that notwithstanding, just the president benefits when the economy is good and suffers when the economy is bad, regardless of the macro forces. The fact with the Middle East, you are absolutely right. That's a liability for Hillary Clinton. And I do worry that the Democrats, because their natural inclination is to talk more about the domestic policies that get everyone in the crowd really, really excited, they don't spend quite enough time dealing with -- I happen to think that American anxieties of terrorism are way inflated. And in fact, the risk of terrorist threats I think is very low.

LEMON: Yeah.

BEINART: But the political reality partly because of what people on your side of the aisle have done is real and have to respond to it.


BEINART: John Kerry ...

MCENANY: We do have to do that, but ...


LEMON: And we'll be back. Don't go anywhere.


[01:32:11] LEMON: The CNN Grill, this is the place to be. You know, everybody's trying to get in here? They're all ...


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Everybody wants to get in.


LEMON: ... in the CNN Grill. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I barely got in.


LEMON: The security like people checking I.D.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They're like, "Who are you, Don?"

LEMON: Yeah.


LEMON: Who are you? When I'd say, they wouldn't let me in. I'm like, "OK, well."


LEMON: Joining me now, all of these people, but also -- Oh, wait a minute, I'm sorry. There's a new guy. David Chalian, you look like Baldwin brother. Actor and activist Billy Baldwin, with us. Are you enjoying this is?

BILLY BALDWIN, ACTOR AND ACTIVIST: Very much so. I told you I've been to the DNC since '88 and the RNC since 1992. And I'm a bit of a political junkie, so I really enjoy the process.

LEMON: What did you think of Bill Clinton's speech tonight?

BALDWIN: You know, I thought he had a different role to play. I've seen him speak at the -- I think three or four times since 1988. And after the re-election speech for Obama and the last election cycle, they ran a poll online that said vote for Mitt Romney, vote to re- elect Barack Obama, vote to amend the constitution to allow Bill Clinton to seek a third term. And he won that poll for about a week. That's how good he is.

I thought it wasn't the razzle-dazzle that I'm used to but it was for the role that he played which was, you know, this convention's got to be one part of the case against Trump, one part the case for Hillary in many, many different ways and then the roadmap to get us there, and I think tonight was the night was the case for Hillary.

Humanizing her, making her accessible, making her appealing -- anyway, look, I worked on the hill for a congressman who was Al Gore's best friend and he asked me directly several times what do you think -- he did the mock debates against Al Gore. And he said, what do you think? And I said, I hate to say this being an actor but Al Gore needs an acting coach because the way he is on television, I'm going to put it in a lock box.

It's not the way -- he's like a policy wonk and he's as very cerebral on camera. But in life when you're driving from one event to another when the cameras are rolling, he's not a totally different guy but he's much different. And I think that's partially what Hillary struggles with. She's not Bill, she'll never be Bill but she possesses many, many wonderful qualities behind closed doors that she gets to get bottled up a little bit for the public.

LEMON: Okay, okay. This is how he ended the speech and then we'll discuss.


BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I hope you'll do it. I hope you'll elect her. Those of us who have more yesterdays than tomorrows, tend to care more about our children and grandchildren. The reason you should elect her is that in the greatest country on earth, we have always been about tomorrow. Your children and grandchildren will bless you forever if you do. God bless you. Thank you.


[01:35:05] LEMON: So I tend to agree with you. You know, I've seen lots of speeches. One, you know, back in 2012 when he's like, it's simple arithmetic and everybody is like, wow, and they called him the Explainer in Chief. If you're someone who has to make speeches in front of people, you know that they're different -- you're different when you're with a different group and trying to give a different message. This was about he wanted people to know the wife and then he want to people to know the change-maker as he said and the politicians and the story that he believes are just mistold by her opponent.

BALDWIN: I think it's very true. I loved -- You know, I met a girl. I love the way he started with that.

CARDONA: That was so cute.

BALDWIN: And then, of course, you can't get out of a speech without getting into the specifics of the resume and of the accomplishments. And he checked all of those boxes, too. I personally think that she's earned it, she's got the resume, it's her turn, and I think that she got very high negatives. Also, a lot of people want to make it sound like these were manufactured by the media or by Fox News or something.

I personally think that she's brought a lot of bit upon her herself because of some of the -- some of the ways in which some of the things were handled. If I were advising her on Benghazi, I would have told her to do what Harry Truman did. The buck stops here. I don't get involved in the minutia on that level, but I could promise you right now, I will do everything in my power to prevent it from happening.

CARDONA: She did to that.

MCENANY: Only when pushed by the media.

CARDONA: Absolutely did that.


LEMON: Let the conservative respond. What are you saying?

MCENANY: I think you're exactly right. I think that makes a lot of sense and I think that there's a reason that 68 percent of voters don't trust her. That didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened after a consecutive line of scandals, the e-mail scandal, Clinton Foundation, Benghazi. Perhaps it's the way they were handled.

I agree with you. With the e-mail situation, if she would have come right out said that, "This shouldn't have happened. I made a mistake." Instead of trying to say the state department approved this, it would have been a lot better.

BEINART: I disagree. If you look at PolitiFact, for instance, you find that actually among all the candidates who ran on both Democratic and Republican side, Hillary Clinton has one of the lowest ratings of people who have made false statements. I don't think ...

MCENANY: And who's got the highest?


BEINART: He got the Pulitzer Prize. You're not going to like it but I don't think you can explain Hillary Clinton's unfavorable rating without understanding the way

that men and some women who are traditionally-minded respond to women when they start to take traditionally male roles. There is an enormous ...

MCENANY: I couldn't agree with you more.


LEMON: It's clearly in play for sure.

BEINART: If you see this, I mean again, they have studied this in all kinds of workplace environments. When women gets jobs ...

MCENANY: No question.

BEINART: ... that women have not traditionally get, they get a lot of negative reaction.

MCENANY: Yes, absolutely.

BEINART: And you cannot take that out of the story of the country's reaction to Hillary Clinton.

MCENANY: If you think 70 percent of the nation doesn't trust her because she's a female --

BEINART: No, that's not what I said. That's not what I said.

LEMON: He's saying it has an effect.


BEINART: It has an effect. There's one of the ...

(CROSSTALK) MCENANY: You know what has an effect?

BEINART: ... change that is threatening because women are not playing the traditional role that some Americans including some women would like them to continue.


LEMON: And that's the whole thing about that glass ceiling tonight that she shattered. And so we'll see. Now she's going up ...

RYE: Very impactful.

LEMON: ... the most popular people in the world are going against each other. I mean, we have great jobs here because we get to be front and center for all of this. Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back.


[01:42:05] LEMON: And we're back. Guess where we are?


LEMON: We're at Philly at the CNN Grill where -- I mean, this is behind the velvet ...

RYE: Curtain.

LEMON: Curtain. Yeah

RYE: Did you say role?

LEMON: There's a rope line, you know?


LEMON: Yeah, rope -- no, rope, R-O-P-E. So, I'm back with my political dream team. And I could say the newest member, right?

CARDONA: There you go.

LEMON: Actor and activist Billy Baldwin is part of that as well. So you come -- you came and you hang out with us for the Republican National Convention in Cleveland last week.


LEMON: Now you're here, what do you think -- compare and contrast the two different ...

BALDWIN: A lot to compare and contrast. Well, let's start with we've got Meryl Streep and they've got Chachi, if that just doesn't says it all. I really think that -- again, I've been to the conventions for a long time since the '80s. And I think that these conventions demonstrate the Republican Party is the party of I and me and the Democratic Party is the party of us and we. And I think that ...

RYE: I like that.

BALDWIN: ... the Republican convention was hostile -- Let me finish. It was hostile, it was negative, it was attacking, it was race baiting, it was fear mongering. The Democratic convention so far has been hopeful, it's been accessible, it's been positive, it's been substantive. It hasn't been enough specifics in the substance, I'm hoping that's what lies ahead in day three and day four. There hasn't been nearly as much attacks on Donald Trump as there were attacks on Hillary Clinton.

Quite honestly, I think that the (inaudible) come off to make the case for Hillary, somebody has to go after Trump and show how -- I know this guy and I know him for a long time. I don't know how well you know him. I know him for a long time. Not well.

CARDONA: Elizabeth Warren did that pretty well.

BALDWIN: This guy


BALDWIN: You guys, this is our Brexit, OK? It was now our chance to come up with the answer. It was that the opportunity of a lifetime for the Republican Party and they came up ...

MCENANY: And they won?

BALDWIN: ... with Donald Trump?

MCENANY: And proof of that -- proof of how successful the convention (inaudible), is an immediate aftermath we saw -- in the immediate aftermath we saw that 56 percent were more likely to vote for Trump, that's confirmed by the biggest post-convention polling that we've had since 2000. It was a successful convention. Because you know what? It was realistic. It described the way the American people felt, and it provided solutions. Here, we're trying to humanize Hillary Clinton, we're trying to act like there's this positive life out there that people are living, and it just doesn't comport with reality and does not feel ...

CARDONA: A couple things, though, Kayleigh. First of all, everybody knows that one post-convention bump for one party until the other party has their convention. It's not realistic, period. So let's wait until whatever polling comes out of our convention and then we can compare, number one. Number two, talking about the differences between the conventions completely agree with everything that Billy said in terms of pessimism versus optimism, hope versus apocalyptic America. And that also is not where America is. And number three, just a couple of differences that I think are critical. We had more diversity and more people of color coming up and talking on our stage ...

[01:45:07] LEMON: One night.

CARDONA: ... than the Republican Party did the entirety of their four days in the GOP convention in that arena.

MCENANY: The Democrats eventually ...

CARDONA: And that represents the differences between the parties and what they represent for America.

MCENANY: The Democrats have been putting forward this narrative that it was dark and it was negative and you saw in lockstep fashion all newspapers lined up and said dark, negative. But then why did 75 percent of viewers say it was very or somewhat positive?


LEMON: One point, one point, and then I'll let you make another point. Let me make this one point, because most of the people watching were Republican conservatives.


LEMON: And most of the people watching ...

MCENANY: Thirty million people watched. They were not all Republicans

LEMON: Stand by. Most of the people watching tonight are Democrats. Now, go on. Finish your point.

MCENANY: Thirty million people watched. These people were not all Republicans.

LEMON: Not all of them but most of them.

MCENANY: Billions of Democrats watched. And to get 75 percent of people to agree that it was very or somewhat positive, we are saying it's the Washington punditry, the political class is completely out of touch with the American people. That's the story of this election, it's the story ...

BEINART: But Kayleigh, it's not normal to have to refrain at a convention be lock her up.


BEINART: That is something abnormal in an American politics. What I found having been in Cleveland, which is frightening to me frankly, is that you see two completely different Americas ...


BEINART: ... at these two conventions. If you were at the Republican Convention and then you came from Mars and they said what are the demographics of America, you would think America was Finland. You would think America was Norway, right? It was (inaudible) 99 percent white country. The Democratic Party is far more diverse than actually most elite institution in the United States. And this campaign is not really about the size of government. It's not really about America's role in the world. It's about a multi-cultural egalitarian America versus a nostalgic nationalistic America.


BEINART: The very soul of America and that's what makes it in some ways of ...

LEMON: I got to go. But he's going to leave, so I'm going to give him the last word.

BALDWIN: I'll stay.

LEMON: Are you going to stay? You were disappointed in the diversity of the RNC? Are you disappointed in the diversity here?

BALDWIN: Oh, not at all, I thought the moment with Trayvon Martin's mother was really, really special tonight. You would never see that at the RNC. And I think that, you know, the whole black - this isn't, you know, black lives matter or this isn't a black issue or blue issue.


BALDWIN: This is black and blue. We've got to bring these two sides together. And the first order of business for Hillary or for Trump, whoever wins, they've got to bring these two sides together. And I think this is an issue. It's very complicated but I think you can make a lot of progress and gain a lot of headway immediately if you get the right people.

LEMON: But here's the thing. This is what I found that was different about tonight when they talked about black versus blue. It was so inclusive.

CARDONA: It was.

LEMON: We want police officers to be safe. We want to engage. We want to have a dialogue. The first conversation I had about that was an argument where it was black against but that's what it is and it's not what the president had been saying.

CARDONA: Not at all.

LEMON: And every single person in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, had been saying we have to stop this. We need to come together. We ...


LEMON: ... the conversation and not yell at each other and say, no, it's your fault, it's your fault, the black people versus ...

BALDWIN: I think Bill Clinton and the Democratic Convention are very artfully. He spoke about black lives matter but he spun it and wove it in a very subtle and sophisticated message about how blue lives matter, too, but that's just as important.

LEMON: And American lives matter. BALDWIN: Yeah

LEMON: Like all of us is American. We got a yes black lives matter. Yes, we do care about police officers who are being shot on the street. But we're all Americans and we need to start talking instead of wanting -- instead of some people wanting to become famous because they're creating a certain narrative about some person versus another person and they've reached that -- let's just say the sheriff has found out that, oh my gosh, I can become famous and popular by creating a certain narrative and not wanting to talk to other people. So that's his role. Not that he wants to help anybody ...

RYE: That takes the life of itself.

LEMON: ... but himself and it takes on a life of its own.


LEMON: Now he's caught up in that, he's become it, he has to do that.

CARDONA: Can I say one ...

LEMON: We got to go break and we'll come back and we'll talk about it.


LEMON: Thank you very much.

BALDWIN: Thanks for having me.

LEMON: I appreciate it. We'll be right back.


[01:53:06] LEMON: Back now at the CNN Grill with my political dream team and Billy Baldwin has gotten more handsome. He looks like David Chalian.

So, David, we were talking about -- we were comparing and contrasting the two conventions. Billy Baldwin was talking about diversity and also about inclusion when it comes to Black Lives Matter, police officers and on and on and on. There was a different sort of feel up on the stage today.

CHALIAN: Yeah, I mean, listen, first of all, the two conventions should be different, right? They're presenting two totally different visions for America and the future. That's the whole point of the election, right?

So -- But I do think that, you know, somebody this week was also invoking Barack Obama's 2004 speech, how we're not a red America and blue America. We are divided. And I think that the contrast really has been clear between last week and this week in the different visions of America, what it is now and where it wants to be. And I think that that's what's going to be fought out across the country from now till November.

LEMON: You said it was optimism versus doom and gloom, you don't see it that way, do you?

MCENANY: No, no, I ...

LEMON: You think that it's elite media.

MCENANY: I see it as reality versus a false reality, authenticity versus inauthenticity. I mean, when you are the president of the United States, you basically give the theme for this convention before it even started. In a press conference Friday, he said, the notion that there's violence and chaos around the world just doesn't jive with reality. That's false. There is violence and chaos on our streets, in Orlando, in Dallas, in Baton Rouge. The notion that there's no violence and chaos and the fact that ISIS wasn't mentioned and any of the 61 speakers yesterday, it was mentioned five times today ...

LEMON: How did you know I asked that ...

MCENANY: ... one of your major problems.

LEMON: They said that's tomorrow night but I ...

MCENANY: That's on purpose.

LEMON: It's on purpose but I do think it's a missed opportunity, because I do think Americans are concerned ...

MCENANY: When you'll see it.

LEMON: ... about that.

MCENANY: They'll hear it tomorrow.

LEMON: Right.

CARDONA: I think one of the greatest contrasts to me is that for the Republican Convention, you had a multibillionaire who grew up and was able to have a successful business with every, every possible thing that he could have that he was given, every single advantage that he was given in life. And he thinks America is doom and gloom and apocalyptic.

[01:55:26] And then you had here, the mothers of the movement, who have gone through the most tragic, soul-eviscerating, heart-crashing events and they think America is ...

LEMON: They were optimistic.

BEINART: That's the amazing thing is the shift. I mean, I think the fundamental divide between the two parties is basically Republican Party has this idea in their minds of some previous year, whether it was 1985 under Ronald Reagan, 1955 with Beaver Cleaver. And they think basically, things have gotten worse and worse since then. That does -- the Democratic Party basically thinks we have an African- American president. We're going to have a female president. We have gay marriage that we have a lot of problems, but we're much, much better off. Those are the two fundamental narratives.

LEMON: Well, that may scare some members of the Conservative Party.

RYE: Well, in here, it does. That's true. That's true.

LEMON: All right, I've got to go. I got to go, I'm sorry, Angela, I got to cut you off. Why do you cut Angela off? Why did you cut Kayleigh off? Well, you hate them.

RYE: Come on, man.

LEMON: I got a whole another show to go, whole another hour.

RYE: All right.

LEMON: We'll be back live from the CNN Grill at the Democratic National Convention right here in Philadelphia, City of Brotherly Love.