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Senate Delays Vote on Next Obamacare Repeal Bill; President Again Tweet Slam of AG Sessions; North Korea Irate After CIA Director's Comments; Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired July 26, 2017 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


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[13:31:21] WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: The U.S. Senate pumps the brakes a bit on the next bill to try to repeal Obamacare. A vote set for earlier today has now been delayed until later this afternoon.

Let's get an update on where things stand, what happens next. CNN congressional correspondent Phil Mattingly, he's up on Capitol Hill. CNN Money senior writer Tami Luhby is joining us from New York.

Phil, explain how this process is playing out and what happens next.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Wolf, we're right in the thick of the Senate debate. The amendment debate . Right now we're basically seeing Senate Republicans, Senate Democrats, kind of jockeying back and forth about what will be voted on next.

I think it's important to note, you know, you mentioned that initially at 11:30 they're scheduled to have a vote on the repeal only bill, one that they expect will actually go down, won't have the votes to move forward, but they made promises to their members that they would have that vote.

Now why that has been delayed, kind of gets into the weeds here about why this process over the course of the next couple of days is going to be very complicated. In order for amendments to only have a simple majority threshold, they need to comply with budget rules and those rules are pretty strict, and one issue that has continually popped up on this is related to Republican efforts to effectively defund Planned Parenthood for a year.

So what is happening right now, why the delay occurred is there's kind of arguments going back and forth between Republicans and Democrats with the Senate parliamentarian as to whether or not the current language passes muster, can be moved through with just a simple majority. Republicans say they should be fine, they think they'll be OK, that vote will occur at 3:30. But we're waiting to see how that turns out. And then after that, the amendment just process keeps on moving along -- Wolf.

BLITZER: You know, Tami, Senate Republicans are desperately trying to come up with any bill that can get at least the 50 votes that they need. The vice president can then break the tie. Walk us through the plans we'll likely to see them voting on. TAMI LUHBY, CNN MONEY SENIOR WRITER: Sure. Well, as Phil said, the

first one that's going to be up is the repeal and delay plan. That would repeal the individual and employer mandates immediately but would keep Obamacare around for another two years, ending the subsidies and Medicaid expansion by 2020.

The reason for that is that lawmakers need time to actually come up with a replacement plan. We've seen how difficult that's been over the last couple of months. But this plan, according to CBO, would actually cause 32 million more people to be uninsured. By 2026, premiums would double and amazingly three quarters of the country would live in areas with no insurer on the individual market so that would be very difficult for them.

We also have two other plans that are coming up. One that -- a more recent one that's called skinny repeal, you may have heard a lot about that in the last couple of days. That would actually end the employer and individual mandates now and it would probably end the tax on the medical devices. The CBO looked at this earlier a couple of years ago and it would probably cause 15 million people to be uninsured. 15 million more people to be uninsured. And would cause a 20 percent spike in premiums.

The last thing that will probably rear its head again is actually the Senate repeal and replace bill that everyone's been working on for months now. That actually ends the individual and employer mandates but keeps a form of the Obamacare subsidies. It eliminates funding -- enhanced funding for Medicaid expansion and curtails funding for Medicaid overall.

That's been a very controversial bill, that's what they haven't been able to agree on. That bill, according to CBO, would -- or a version of that bill would leave 22 million more people uninsured by 2026. It would cause premiums to drop, but it would cause a lot of problems in the market as well.

BLITZER: You know, Phil, the Senate Republican leadership, they want something to pass, so at least they could go back to the House, have a House Senate conference committee and then continue to work on this so there wouldn't be complete failure. What are you hearing?

MATTINGLY: Yes, preface with things are fluid, and things could change, absolutely. But the kind of plans that Tami laid out, the skinny or scaled back repeal, appears to be the direction things are heading right now. And for the exact rationale you've mentioned, Wolf.

Basically having a vehicle to just keep this process moving, get it to conference committee, start to try and hammer out details with the House. There are still work going on behind the scenes to try and figure out a way to lock in a repeal and replace, a more fuller kind of conclusion amendment here, but as of now and as we've seen over the last couple of weeks, Wolf, this continues to come up short.

If that's the case, keep a very close eye on this scaled back repeal. Again with the idea being that would not be the final policy, but that would at least move it forward, have another kind of victory on the Senate floor and then kind of go back behind the scenes and try and hammer things out at the House. We've got a wild next 48 hours. But those are kind of the options on the table right. We'll have to see what they end up coming up with -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Phil Mattingly, thanks very much. Tami Luhby, thanks to you as well.

Other stories we're following the U.S. Attorney General Jeff Sessions, he was at the White House today even as President Trump was continuing to criticize him directly on Twitter. So how long can all of this go on? How long can the attorney general hold on? We'll discuss that and more with our panel right after this.

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[13:40:39] BLITZER: President Trump is keeping up the pressure on the attorney general of the United States, Jeff Sessions. Once again today the president issued an official White House statement in his chosen form, that would be Twitter. Quote, "Why didn't AG Sessions replace acting FBI Director Andrew McCabe, a Comey friend, who was in charge of Clinton investigation but got big dollars, $700,000, for his wife's political run from Hillary Clinton and her representatives. Drain the swamp," close quote.

Here with us set to discuss this and more, our chief political analyst Gloria Borger, our senior political reporter Nia-Malika Henderson, our senor political analyst Mark Preston and our political reporter, the CNN editor at large, Chris Cillizza.

So now, Gloria, that tweet from the president attacking Sessions and the acting FBI director McCabe, he got $700,000 from the Democratic governor, his wife did, the -- was running for office in Virginia.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Right.

BLITZER: From the Democratic governor of Virginia, Terry McAuliffe, not directly from Hillary Clinton. Just an important point. But he's still after all the criticism he's received, the president going after Sessions?

BORGER: Well, it's like a dog with a bone, and he's not going to -- clearly not going to let go of this, and what he's trying to do with these tweets is make the case to members of Congress, who were saying leave the guy alone, leave the guy alone, he cares about your agenda, he's doing what you want on your agenda. He's trying to make the case that there are true conflicts here, and that Jeff Sessions has not taken care of it. Whether it's with McCabe or leak investigations, as he's tweeted about before.

He's using Twitter to make his case to conservatives and to Republicans, you know, whether with that will matter remains to be seen. But the question that I have is, look, if you're going to fire him, do it. I mean, why are you continuing to tweet about it like this? NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and

you heard Lindsey Graham today essentially saying this is weak sauce from the president. Him not firing Lindsey Graham and having him twist in the wind and basically sort of mouth off on Twitter. If he wanted to fire the guy, he should fire him, rather than just sort of trash talk him in the press.

I think the question is, what sort of -- I mean we've seen this backlash obviously from conservatives, you see Donald Trump trying to rebrand Sessions as something sort of other than conservative, and somebody who's not cracking down on leaks, somebody who's going easy on Hillary Clinton.

I think the problem is conservatives know Sessions. They know Sessions more than they know Donald Trump.

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BORGER: He's more conservative --

HENDERSON: He's more -- exactly. Yes.

BLITZER: He's a very conservative -- he's a very conservative attorney general, and when he was a senator from Alabama, very, very conservative. His fellow Alabama senator, Richard Shelby, defending him very, very strongly. Listen to this.

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SEN. RICHARD SHELBY (R), ALABAMA: Well, he's a strong guy, a man with integrity and purpose. I told him to hang in there really well, I hope. He deserves better than this. You know, he is not the president's personal lawyer, he's an attorney general of the United States. He took an oath to the Constitution, not to the president, and I think the president needs to realize that, that he is not his lawyer.

He's had a lot of experience in law enforcement. He's on the Judiciary Committee, former United States attorney for a long time. He's a man with a lot of friends and a lot of respect.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: It's not just Senator Shelby, it's a lot of conservative Republicans making the same points.

MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: And centrist Republicans as well who have made a point to acknowledge that they don't always agree with Jeff Sessions on immigration or whatever, really right of center issues that he's proposing. But they said he's a man of integrity. They tell he's honest. And let's not forget, he served for like 20 years in the United States Senate. So they know Jeff Sessions.

Richard Shelby I think really made the best argument there. Jeff sessions is not the lawyer for the president of the United States. He did not take a loyalty oath to the president of the United States. He took a loyalty oath to the Constitution of the United States. And I still think after these six or so months that he's been in office, Donald Trump still doesn't understand that.

BLITZER: Do you think the president is going to reconsider, sit down with the attorney general and work this out?

CHRIS CILLIZZA, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: I think there are two -- normally I would say no, but I think with Trump, he loves two things. He -- well, he loves one thing that can go two ways.

[13:45:05] He loves sort of drama, particularly when it's televised, particularly when it's about him. So I think he could come to a meeting in which he comes out and says, you know what, I told Attorney General Sessions he wasn't doing the job that he needed to do when I fired him.

I think it is also possible because there's nothing TV likes than the unexpected twist that he meets with senator -- Attorney General Sessions and he says, you know, we worked it out, we had a good conversation. He kind of likes that. Remember Ben Carson who he said had a pathology similar to a child molester during the campaign. Low energy Jeb. Lying Ted, who now is apparently a potential attorney general replacement.

He -- there is a part of him that likes that. Hey, we got together, we hated each other, but now we like each other. So everything he said would lead me to believe the opposite of that, but I also know that the guy has a flare for sort of the dramatic, particularly as it's televised and maybe that's what he does.

BORGER: But there are people inside the White House who are clearly trying to talk him out of this, the firing, because they understand that it could start a whole kind of domino effect, right, that could be very detrimental to the president. But he still tweeted this morning.

HENDERSON: Yes.

BORGER: And so --

BLITZER: He tweeted this morning, going after Sessions and the acting FBI director, while Sessions was over at the White House meeting with other officials, not with the president.

HENDERSON: Yes. Right, right, right.

BLITZER: Yes.

HENDERSON: I mean going again to, I mean this is guy who sort of frames himself as a tough guy, but doesn't really like to fire people, doesn't necessarily like confrontation, which he would have to have if he ended up firing Jeff Sessions so he's just basically trash talking and trying to get him to leave.

I think one thing you see him do today with this transgender ban and announcing that, for days you've seen conservatives hammering Donald Trump on Twitter, on air, Rush Limbaugh, for going after Sessions and now he's essentially saying to conservatives that he's one of them, that Donald Trump is one of them and you see conservatives now basically praising this decision around transgender or transgender ban in the military. So I think that was strategic.

BLITZER: So you think, Nia, he was just trying to change the subject?

HENDERSON: I think so and I think it worked. I mean, if you look on Twitter, conservatives who have been hammering him for days around this Sessions thing now saying, you know, this is the right thing to do. And this transgender issue was a big issue for Sessions, right out of the gate. It's something he came out and said that he wasn't going to protect transgender students in public schools.

PRESTON: Right. And I think these are conservatives who have had, specifically social conservatives, had with Donald Trump. They were able to put aside because they saw him as a vessel to try to get their agenda through. They had difficulty getting through certainly in the Obama administration. And even in the Bush administration as well because, you know, George W. Bush was, you know, considered a compassionate conservative, wasn't always on board with what the social conservatives were trying to do.

But I do think it's very important. Not only did he attack Jeff Sessions today, he attacked Lisa Murkowski. And guess what, in this town, it gets very lonely in the Oval Office when you have no allies.

BLITZER: The tweet on Lisa Murkowski, the senator from Alaska, a Republican senator, "Senator Lisa Murkowski of the great state of Alaska really let the Republicans and our country down yesterday. Too bad." She was one of two Republicans --

BORGER: Right.

BLITZER: With Susan Collins to vote against opening up the debate.

BORGER: And it shouldn't be any surprise to him. I always love in these meetings, by the way, which the president has in the Roosevelt Room. He always puts Susan Collins on one side and Lisa Murkowski on the other, it didn't do him any good.

HENDERSON: Right. Right.

BORGER: Because they both voted against him. But, you know, to take on a sitting Republican senator and to basically say she doesn't have the interests of her constituents at heart is kind of unseemly, when you're a member of the Senate and you're looking to see if the president is going to have your back on a tough issue, he won't.

CILLIZZA: And just to add to that point, remember, Lisa Murkowski's father, Frank Murkowski, served in the Senate for a very long time.

HENDERSON: Yes.

CILLIZZA: Everyone there know -- HENDERSON: She's an institution in Alaska.

CILLIZZA: I mean, this is an attack on not just Lisa Murkowski but on the institution. They all remember that.

BLITZER: All right, guys, Gloria, Mark, Nia and Chris, thanks very, very much.

Once again we're only moments away from the White House briefing. All of these issues are about to be raised with the press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders. This will be on camera. It will be live. You will see it here on CNN. Stay with us.

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[13:53:25] BLITZER: Some world leaders are voicing their disapproval over a U.S. plan to impose new sanctions against Russia, Iran, and North Korea. The measure passed the House of Representatives yesterday overwhelmingly, now heads back to the Senate where an earlier passed a slightly different version, again, overwhelmingly. It gives Congress the power to block the White House from weakening sanctions on Moscow. North Korea doesn't seem too bothered by the new sanctions, but Pyongyang is irate over comments made by the CIA director.

CNN's Will Ripley is in Seoul for us with that part of the story -- Will.

WILL RIPLEY, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, North Korean officials as recently as last month when I was in Pyongyang did not same fazed at all by the prospect of additional sanctions from the United States, the U.N. or anyone. They are used to being sanctioned.

North Korea's economy is one of the most heavily sanctioned on earth and yet according to South Korean estimates it grow by near 4 percent last year largely because of North Korea's trade relationship with China.

And the sanctions also have done little to slow the pace, the frantic, unprecedented pace of missile testing that we've seen, including that ICBM launch on the Fourth of July. North Korea has also conducted five nuclear tests.

And what really provokes their anger, the reason why we're seeing these threats from Pyongyang, not so much the sanctions, but the rhetoric from the CIA Director Mike Pompeo who talked about regime change last week, saying the U.S. would like to see North Korea's Supreme Leader Kim Jong-un separated from his country's rapidly growing nuclear and missile arsenal. Also implying that the North Korean people themselves would like to see their leader ousted from power.

That predictably drew a furious response, a threat of annihilation on the heart of the U.S. by North Korea launching a missile which experts say they're getting closer every day to attaining an ICBM that could carry a nuclear tipped warhead to the mainland U.S. [13:55:09] There are even signs right now that equipment is rolling

into a launch site in Kusong, North Korea that could be used to launch a ballistic missile really in the coming hours as North Korea prepares to celebrate the 7/27 Armistice signing, a day they call Victory Day when they have traditionally tried to show strength and may try to send a defiant, angry message to the United States -- Wolf.

BLACKWELL: Will Ripley reporting for us from Seoul, South Korea. Will has been to North Korea now about a dozen times over the past few years.

That's it for me. Thanks very much for watching. I'll be back 5:00 p.m. Eastern in "THE SITUATION ROOM."

Coming up right at the top of the hour, we'll have live coverage of the White House press briefing. Sarah Huckabee Sanders, the White House press secretary, getting ready to answer reporters' questions on a whole range of breaking issues. Full coverage of that coming up right after a quick break.

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