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PRIMETIME JUSTICE WITH ASHLEIGH BANFIELD

Mother Convicted of Killing her Own Son; Drunk Driver Suspect Remorseful in Front of Camera; Cops: Robber in shootout with mom and daughter, try defending themselves with gun behind register; Updating hero of the year`s story; Best and worst driving states. Aired 6-8p ET

Aired March 8, 2018 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[18:00:00] (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s got five kids.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are the kids here? Do you mind if we step in? We got a call saying, want us to check on the well-being of the five or four to

five-year-old.

LARISSA RODRIGUEZ, CHARGE WITH MUDER: All my kids are good.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, HLN HOST: That is the call you never want to get at your front door, especially if you actually have nine kids but one of them is

missing, and you haven`t told a soul.

I`m Ashleigh Banfield. This is Crime and Justice.

Tonight, Larissa Rodriguez is in a whole lot of trouble. She`s behind bars while pregnant with her 10th, and she`s charged with the murder of a 5-

year-old son.

The officers you saw would not find that son for another day because Larissa didn`t tour them through the backyard. And that`s where little

Jordan`s body was rotting, buried in a shallow grave, hardly noticeable to anyone.

But the brother of Larissa`s boyfriend seemed to know all about it, and he called the police from where he was working as a contractor way over in

Pakistan. And that call led them right to Larissa. So with that backdrop, the tape becomes even more intriguing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Per the caller, the child was possibly buried a couple of months ago.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can we see?

RODRIGUEZ: Sure thing they`re in there now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. I believe you.

RODRIGUEZ: That`s my oldest one.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Negative, just found the brother of a Christopher Rodriguez and his girlfriend, Larissa Rodriguez.

RODRIGUEZ: I mean, they`re all fine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. Hello, kids. All right. All right. What`s your name, ma`am?

RODRIGUEZ: Larissa.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Apparently Larissa has nine other children.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many kids do you have, ma`am?

RODRIGUEZ: I have nine altogether.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

RODRIGUEZ: But I have some that don`t live with me. But these are the ones that do live with me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Do you have a child with special needs?

RODRIGUEZ: Jordan? Yes, I do.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How old is Jordan?

RODRIGUEZ: Jordan, he is just turned 5. But he`s with his dad.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is Jordan at?

RODRIGUEZ: He`s with his dad. He`s visiting, going to be visiting for the holiday. He`s not here with us today, not right now, for the holiday.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is dad at?

RODRIGUEZ: In Texas. He`s not even here. What was the call maybe about?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just checking the welfare.

RODRIGUEZ: I mean, I don`t know what this is pertaining to.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you say you had nine?

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All your kids.

RODRIGUEZ: I`m only missing -- OK.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You got nine. You`re couple short there.

RODRIGUEZ: OK. I`m going to put the ones that I don`t have right here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many kids -- you have these children to live with you, right? One, two, three, four, five, six. Six live with you.

RODRIGUEZ: Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Five of the children actually live with her because it is likely at this point, they suspect one of them is dead. And the officers are sure

to ask about that little 5-year-old. But Larissa says Jordan, well, he is just somewhere else.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ma`am, I would really love to get in touch with Jordan.

RODRIGUEZ: OK. Is there any way I can give you -- when I find the number to contact you?

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many special kids she got?

RODRIGUEZ: I got two.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are any of the kids disabled?

RODRIGUEZ: He`s not really disabled. He`s the one with his dad.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How old is he?

RODRIGUEZ: He just turned five?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Where does he live?

RODRIGUEZ: He`s staying -- he doesn`t live there, but he`s just visiting for the holidays.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What -- in Texas?

RODRIGUEZ: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is he usually upstairs?

RODRIGUEZ: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jordan has, he has family members in Texas?

RODRIGUEZ: Yes, yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. Do you know any numbers or any -- how to get in touch with anybody who actually lives in Texas?

RODRIGUEZ: I mean, right now, his phone got disconnected. I`m waiting for him to call me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What`s his address?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Crime and Justice producer, Justin Freiman has been following this story for us all day. This videotape is chilling for so many reasons.

Number one, this is a young mother, aged 34, who has ostensibly given birth nine times.

She`s sitting in the county jail, pregnant with her tenth, and this is the information that they`re bringing out against her. The first meeting police

had at her house. Walk me through a little bit more of the backdrop of this whole story, Justin.

JUSTIN FREIMAN, PRODUCER, CRIME & JUSTICE: Well, actually, it starts out believe it or not with a call all the way from Pakistan. Her boyfriend who

had been living with her just before police arrived there. He apparently called his brother who was working in Pakistan and tells him this whole

story about coming home to the girlfriend, and that there`s a dead child, and they bury the child in the yard. And that`s what triggered this whole

thing going forward.

[18:05:08] BANFIELD: So they record all, you know, calls that come in to the police, they record 911 calls. You know, that`s just -- you never know

when this stuff is going to become evidence. And lo and behold, her boyfriend`s brother, the contractor in Pakistan, the phone call he made to

police to tip them off to this, well, it was recorded. And of course we do have evidence of that. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Basically he told me that something happened with one of the kids, and they didn`t call the cops. And basically he buried -- him and

his girlfriend buried the kid in the backyard.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So this, Justin, is what the police knew or at least the tip they had as they approached her and went on this tour, this remarkable tour

through her house.

FREIMAN: That`s right. And the police had looked around outside and made the note that nothing seemed disturbed outside, but they didn`t realize at

the time this kid was actually dead for a while.

BANFIELD: So, ultimately, I think if we know the timeline, this little child disappeared or may have been dead by September 22nd, right? This is

all last year, 2017.

FREIMAN: That`s right.

BANFIELD: And then Monday, December 18th, they get that 911 report, they get that call from Pakistan, from...

(CROSSTALK)

FREIMAN: That`s right. That`s right. They get that call. And that`s why they`re there.

BANFIELD: And they do this tour and they ask her these questions. And what is her full story to the police about why her little 5-year-old is not

there and the rest of those little ones are there?

FREIMAN: Right. Well she says this one is with his father in Texas. But what doesn`t seem right is that she doesn`t have a phone number, she

doesn`t have an address, and police even say, you know, we can wait here until you get that phone number. She`s like, well, I`m waiting for him to

call me because I don`t have a number. His phone was disconnected.

BANFIELD: So I think if any parent out there is watching now, put yourself in those shoes and ask yourself if there would be a moment in a day where

you would have no idea where your 5-year-old is, how to reach your 5-year- old, or how to maybe reach somebody right away who knows where your 5-year- old is.

And yet, this was the kind of answer that Larissa Rodriguez was giving to these police, often known as the runaround. And in fact, Justin, I want to

play one short moment where I think, you know, in retrospect, now that we know all, that we know and the case is sort of coming forward, not

litigated yet, she`s still innocent until proven guilty, but it is intriguing to hear what she says to these officers about the tip that they

got. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We got a call saying we want us to check on the wellbeing of the 5 -- e to 5-year-old. Where is dad at?

RODRIGUEZ: In Texas. He`s not even here. Is that who you guys are pertaining to?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Maybe, possibly.

RODRIGUEZ: What was the call maybe about?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just checking the welfare.

RODRIGUEZ: I mean, I don`t know what this is pertaining to.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: What was the call maybe about? Do we even know if the police suspected so strongly at that moment. I`m surprised that it took another

day to get into the backyard. Any idea why?

FREIMAN: Yes, they actually because they did not look around earlier, and they didn`t find the child there. They didn`t see anything really

disturbed. But then things just weren`t adding up because they realized that she had been telling a lot of lies. And they went and did a much

strong investigation of the property that very next day. That child was found.

BANFIELD: So the manner of death once they found that child`s remains in the backyard, the manner of death was homicide. They were able somehow to

determine that it is a homicide. The child just didn`t die on his own. He was killed, man on man, that`s what homicide is. But the cause is more

tricky, Justin. Why is that?

FREIMAN: That`s right. Well, apparently the body had been there possibly since September 22nd. They don`t find the body until mid-December, and they

just can`t determine how the child was actually killed.

BANFIELD: But there is this report from the medical examiner -- it`s just so disturbing when you`re talking about a little 5-year-old boy -- that he

was found in bags. And that is plural, correct?

FREIMAN: That`s correct, plural.

BANFIELD: Did they say anything else about that, or are they staying quiet about this in terms of the evidence, you know, preservation until trial?

FREIMAN: Right. They`ve actually been staying very quiet about it. All we do know is, as you were saying, multiple bags the child is found in. But

yet they don`t know the actual means to his death except for that it is a homicide.

[18:09:55] BANFIELD: I want to bring in Ashley Willcott in Atlanta, she`s certified welfare specialist. And I also want to bring child attorney and -

- rather, one of -- she`s a trial attorney and a juvenile court judge. And I`m going to bring in as well in a moment defense attorney Eric Johnson.

But, first to you, Ashley. So many levels of this are so upsetting. But there is another entire story playing out at the same time about the

welfare agencies that are supposed to help us to not let this happen among our flock.

And it turns out that one of those working for the welfare agencies has been charged now with improperly dealing in food stamps with this family,

and ultimately forging documents which means had that welfare agency and that worker in particular been doing her job, this child might be alive.

And it makes me wonder how much does this happen.

ASHLEY WILLCOTT, CERTIFIED CHILD WELFARE LAW SPECIALIST: Yes, two words for this, Ashleigh, system fail. Because that`s what happened in this case. And

I think that had they considered every single report on this mother and her evasiveness probably which happened along the way, there could have been a

very different result for this little boy.

And it`s horrible. And it happens more often than I`d like to think or say. The reality is we see system fails, and we see children die as a result.

BANFIELD: So that woman, Nancy Caraballo is charged with illegal use of food stamps, tampering with government records, as well, which brings me to

you, Eric.

If it is ever determined -- and I`m not sure it can be because the cause of death is unknown, but if it is ever determined that that child was

suffering from malnutrition, doesn`t that up the ante for that worker?

Let alone what Larissa`s going to face on this. What about the ante for that worker if they can figure out that that child suffered because of the

falsified records and whatever quid pro quo was going on?

ERIC JOHNSON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I think as far the worker`s stand it depends on what her actual responsibilities were. If she was only dealing

with the child -- with the food stamp aspect of it, then she might not have been forced or it might not have been her duties for her to check on the

child`s welfare.

I mean, she could have been, the mother could have been taken, going to the office to handle the child support -- I mean, to handle the food stamp...

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: Now she was to be given the all clear as we understand it for checking on those kids 11 times the records were falsified with this

worker. You know, even before I get to that, Ashley, jump in on the notion that there`s a tenth baby right now conceived and waiting to be born,

apparently incubating in a cell.

What happens with these prisoners who are pregnant? They have nine at home.

WILLCOTT: Right.

BANFIELD: Well, eight in this case because one was buried -- and then there`s a tenth on the way. What`s the process from this moment on?

WILLCOTT: Right. So the process is if there`s another parent that`s suitable in this case to have the child when the child is born, then that

parent can be eligible to ask for the child. If there`s a family member, the Child Welfare Agency will consider family members. But the likely

reality is that baby will come into the state system and into foster care given the situation with all of the other children and this mother.

BANFIELD: Yet again, another one that the rest of the flock needs to look after because of whatever went on with this woman -- potentially the

boyfriend, we don`t know, he`s also charged, Christopher Rodriguez, also charged. And Nancy Caraballo, the child welfare worker, apparently dealing

allegedly falsely in food stamps and records. How about that?

Thank you so much to Justin, Ashley, and Eric. Quite a different look in court today, shall we say, for a 21-year-old drunk driving suspect. She was

no longer wearing that pretty bikini that she was during her field sobriety test moments after she had been found after hitting and killing a father

and an unborn child. Instead, Shana Elliott was buttoned up and very sincere as she took the witness stand in an attempt to beg a jury to keep

her out of prison.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Your first concern when you got out of the car.

SHANA ELLIOT, DRUNK DRIVING SUSPECT: The other people.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When you left your car, where did you go?

ELLIOT: Straight to the car.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you straight to help, didn`t you?

ELLIOT: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Also, you can now listen to our show any time. Just download our podcast. It`s found on Apple podcasts, iHeartradio, stitcher tune in or

wherever you get your podcasts for your Crime and Justice fix.

[18:15:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: If you live near a river, it is a summer tradition, grab a tube, fill up a cooler, and go for a float. Unfortunately in San Marcos, Texas,

the neighborhoods say it`s also a tradition for people to get in their cars and drive home after all that fun, after they`ve spent a whole day drinking

on the river.

And one of those people clad only in a bikini was 21-year-old Shana Elliott who had drifted into oncoming traffic and then crashed headfirst into

another car. Police say she was so drunk, she was more than twice the legal limit, and that she couldn`t even stand during her field sobriety test. She

told the cops that she`d only had a few beers, and that not aware that she had taken two lives.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[18:20:01] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you remember much about the accident?

ELLIOT: No. It`s really blurry. I just remember as soon as the accident was -- as soon as the accident happened, I knew that I made the worst decision

ever. I remember getting out of my car and -- me going to other car and making sure they were OK.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But they weren`t, were they?

ELLIOT: No.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

No, they weren`t. In the car that Shana hit was a young, married couple. High school sweethearts, in fact, newlyweds. Fabian and Kristian Guerrero.

Beautiful, beautiful wedding pictures. Fabian was killed, and his wife on the left, she was hurt, and Kristian was pregnant.

But she wasn`t pregnant the next, she lost that baby the day after she lost that husband. And while sorry goes a long way to repair damage, it may not

go nearly far enough in the Texas courtroom where Shana is now throwing herself at the mercy of the jury.

Because just steps away from her on the stand, is the woman who lost absolutely everything her life, steps away from the widow sniffling in that

courtroom.

So you can imagine that emotions were running pretty high, to say the very least.

With me now is Jeffrey Boney, he is an associate editor for the Houston Forward Times. Jeffrey, we hear about drinking and driving all the time

sadly. We hear about cases -- they`re almost a dime a dozen which is also tragic.

But this case, this case stands out. There`s something to it that is just so wrong and just so sad. What is the demeanor of this defendant as she

faces anywhere from nothing, probation, to 50 years which is effectively an eternity for her?

JEFFREY BONEY, ASSOCIATE EDITOR, HOUSTON FORWARD TIMES: Well, Shana Elliott, she took the stand on her own behalf, and she seemed to be

remorseful about what occurred. Even the defense attorneys were emphasizing the fact that she was remorseful after the accident happened.

So in an effort to persuade the jurors, she, you know, basically was trying to go for a relatively lenient sentence for causing this drunken automobile

crash that killed, of course Fabian and their unborn son.

She -- you know, the difference between this situation I guess and any other things is she previously pled guilty to these incidents. She knew

exactly what she had done, and she had previous run-ins with the law. She`s no stranger to the law. She was accused of possessing heroin,

methamphetamine, marijuana back in March of 2016.

She was arrested again for possession of heroin two months later in May of 2016.

So in this situation she was trying to throw herself at the mercy of the court, but she tended to not be remorseful but other actions that she had

done prior to this incident.

BANFIELD: Well, to that end, you know, for anybody who tries to throw their selves -- throw themselves at the mercy of a jury, it is not an easy thing

to do. And if you`re pretending and, you know, shedding crocodile tears, a lot of times they`re smart enough to see right through that, or at least

they can feel something`s up.

So you be the judge when you hear Shana Elliott as she effectively says to the jury what I did was wrong, and God help me, maybe you could have some

mercy. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ELLIOT: I just want to say that -- I want to say to the victims` family that I`m sorry from the deepest of my heart, and I know that an apology

doesn`t do much. You know it -- but I pray for forgiveness every day. And to the jury, I just hope that you can find it in your hearts. Whatever`s

fair for you all, whatever you all punish I accept it because I accept responsibility, and I know what I did was wrong.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Jeffrey, you -- you cannot help but feel sorry for people, generally people. But this young woman, it is not her first time at the

rodeo. She`d admitted to drinking and driving before. And also she`d been arrested three months prior and then I think five months prior for

possession of heroin and methamphetamine and marijuana, and none of that seemed to be a problem.

It certainly didn`t mitigate her behavior on the day when Fabian Guerrero Moreno and his unborn baby who was supposed to be named after him, Fabian,

died.

[18:25:03] So, I guess it really just comes down to how the jurors reacted. And that`s always difficult. We don`t get the camera angle. We`re not

allowed to watch them.

But it`s a hard case -- look, everybody could put themselves in that position. But for the fact that her blood alcohol level was .199. And

that`s nearly double the legal limit which, if you are trying to figure out how you would act if you were .199, and would you make the same mistake, it

is described as being in a condition where your behavior is sloppy, you would feel dazed and confused, disoriented. You might need help to stand or

walk, maybe that`s why Shana can`t keep her balance when she`s doing her bikini test, field sobriety test.

The gag reflexes impaired. You feel like you`re going to vomit. Blackouts are likely at this level, at.199. It doesn`t matter how big you are or how

small you are. Everybody at .199 would get this kind of an effect. Is that being discussed in this trial so that jurors know damn well just how drunk

she was?

BONEY: You know, that is being -- that`s been brought up, but Ashleigh, I think one of the biggest things that the prosecutors brought out in the

sentencing phase here, they played recordings of phone calls that Shana made from jail, and in one of the recordings, you hear her talking with her

boyfriend, speculating that the victims of the crash were part of the cartel.

And in another conversation you hear Shana joking and laughing with her friends about getting her eyebrows threaded in jail just four days after

the crash. So I think they brought that information out to really show that the remorse argument that she was trying to present or at least the

narrative she was trying to present was not how she was really feeling even after being arrested and being in jail for a few days, and that she really

was aware of what she was doing, and this was a part of her overall lifestyle.

BANFIELD: Wow.

(CROSSTALK)

BONEY: And so, yes, they did bring that out. But this was something that`s been...

BANFIELD: Are you kidding -- holy molly. They played those? Jeffrey, they played those audio recordings of her jailhouse conversations where she`s

suggesting that the -- Fabian Guerrero Moreno and his unborn baby and his wife who`s a widow, who`s in that courtroom, were somehow part of a cartel?

BONEY: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: She said those things, and they heard those things?

BONEY: To hear that recording, and then of course, again, hearing her laughing and joking and being jovial with her friends about getting her

eyebrows threaded while she was in jail.

I mean, these are the types of things where, you know, the prosecutors, I believe, did a pretty good job of trying to at least in their -- in their

argument to try to show her as a non-remorseful individual who really was aware of what had happened and that this was a part of her everyday

lifestyle.

BANFIELD: Wow. That is -- that`s brutal. That is brutal. Because it is really convenient to feel the way she feels on the stand, you know, when

your judgment and those 12 faces are in front of you.

But she had no idea probably when she was on that prison call, that jail call, that those 12 faces were going to hear her demeanor while she was

awaiting the trial which brings me to Eric Johnson. Eric, that`s basically in legal speak, that sucks.

JOHNSON: Very much so, very much so.

BANFIELD: It sucks, right?

JOHNSON: Yes, it does. Yes, it does.

BANFIELD: Yes. So how much does it suck because she`s facing zero probation effectively all the way up to 50 years. And jurors, they`re no dummies.

They`re her peers, right?

JOHNSON: Correct.

BANFIELD: They`re going to be able to make the difference between her jailhouse call and then her performance on the stand.

JOHNSON: I think one of the biggest issues from what I`ve seen about this case is the fact that they had a trial in and of itself. I think that her

guilt in this matter was pretty straightforward, so this is something that she may have wanted to take a plea.

And the fact that she`s gone through a trial in which the victim has had to sit there and listen through all of these things may something that be

taken held against her when it comes time for final sentencing.

BANFIELD: Boy, boy, boy, boy. Boy. Can I just put one more thing on this, just before we wrap this up? I want to hear from her one more time. Because

again, I said this wasn`t her first rodeo. I already told you about the drugs. I already told you about the arrests.

But then on the stand under cross-examination, she had to admit, yes, she`s been drinking and driving a lot in the past. Have a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ms. Elliot, you`re a good student, right?

ELLIOT: Yes, sir.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Pretty smart individual?

ELLIOT: Yes, sir.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So you were fully aware of the risks of your actions on August 2nd, 2016?

ELLIOT: To an extent.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re saying the risks didn`t seem real to you, is that what you`re saying?

ELLIOT: It seemed real. It did.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you disregarded that risk?

ELLIOT: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Was this your first time being intoxicated and making the decision to drive?

[18:30:01] ELLIOT: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many times previously had you done that?

ELLIOT: Quite a few, sadly. It`s -- it`s too common, and that`s what needs to change.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice over): OK. Is it fair to say that each time before August 2nd, 2016, you were running the risk of this exact result?

ELLIOTT: Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, PRIMETIME JUSTICE SHOW HOST, HLN: Yes. Too common, it needs to change. And usually the way it changes is when TV people like me

broadcast cases like yours. And you end up in the pokey for a long, long time. And then other people don`t want to end up in the pokey, so they

don`t do it. That`s usually how it works. My thanks to Jeffrey Boney and Eric Johnson (ph) for that.

You ever wonder what it`s like for victims of crimes after the crime? A serial armed robbery suspect holds a gun to a young woman`s head as mom is

looking on. He tries to hold up a store, but he didn`t know that those two women, mom and daughter, they`re going to fight back. They`re going to

fight back hard.

But the bullets fly, and a lot of them fly. And the terror they endured, we`re going to ask that mother what it was like to have to watch the scene

play out in front of her where a man held a gun to her daughter`s head and actually pulled the trigger. That`s next.

[18:35:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Have you ever met anyone who`s had a near-death experience? Entire TV shows are based on it. Some people say they see a bright light,

other people say their whole lives flash before their eyes. I think most people say it is really freaking scary. And it was probably really, really

scary for Tina Ring when a suspected robber pointed a gun at her daughter`s head.

(START VIDEO CLIP)

TINA RING, VICTIM: I saw him reach over the counter and pull the trigger.

BANFIELD (voice over): When 36-year-old Tyrone Lee first came into their family liquor store masked and holding a sawed off shotgun, the mother and

daughter duo stood back and they let him empty the cash register. But as he tried to leave through the first door, they locked the second door, and

that should have trapped him had the first door shut more quickly, but it didn`t.

So he came blazing back into the store where mom and daughter now unloaded their guns. Somehow, though, he wrestled mom to the ground and took her gun

and then hunted down her daughter, taking aim and firing.

But in a stroke of sheer luck, that gun that he just wrestled away was empty, and that daughter was spared and free to run to safety, run out of

the store with her mother. The robbery suspect, for his part, collapsed behind the cash register.

ASHLEY LEE, VICTIM: When I seen him hit her in the head and her face just go white and her eyes -- she had her eyes on me the entire time and it was

like, I wanted to help her, and so I didn`t want to shoot her, and I didn`t want to shoot him, but he hurt my mom. So, I mean, in her defense, I -- I

did what I had to.

RING: Yes. I know she saved me. My hero.

LEE: You`re my hero.

BANFIELD (voice over): So this is Tyrone Lee. He`s got a brand-new mugshot to add to his resume, although in this one it`s little hard to recognize

him, because the ladies managed to get off six rounds into him.

He reportedly drove himself to the hospital before being charged with robbery. And it is not the first time that he has been to this rodeo

either. He`s charged in connection with nine other robberies in the neighborhood, and what is his excuse?

TYRONE LEE, CHARGED WITH ROBBERY: I was running out of gas, I had no cigarettes. My baby needs pampers. You know what I`m saying? I need food to

eat.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So does any of that mean anything to those ladies who lived through that ordeal? Joining me right now is Tina Ring, better known as mom

in this story. And on the phone as well is Ashley Lee, her daughter. They`re the ones who fought back.

And I would say Tina won, although it`s really hard to say that this -- that there`s anything heroic or positive about this because you are -- you

are living with this now. And I could tell from that interview that you did that this is hard.

RING: It is hard. It`s very hard.

BANFIELD: Tell me a little bit about how you and your daughter, Ashley, are getting through, you know, post incident and dealing -- I mean, the news is

over and usually people move on and then you`re just left to cope. How are you guys getting through this?

RING: We just take a breath. And I`m thankful that she`s alive and she`s there for her children. I`m thankful that I`m alive. I get to be there for

my children and my grandchildren. You just --

[18:40:00] I don`t know. I mean --

BANFIELD: It`s hard to walk in your shoes. It`s hard to even know how to walk in your shoes. I do have this one burning question for you, because in

my mind as I watched what happened to you, I thought to myself, God, Tina must have terrified when she found herself out of bullets.

And then in an instant later, Tina must have had the most unbelievable relief when she knew the gun was out of bullets because it was now being

pointed at her daughter`s head.

RING: Well, the whole time that I was wrestling with him, I was making sure that I was pulling the trigger and pulling the trigger and pulling the

trigger and just making sure that it was completely empty because I knew that -- if it had anything left in there that he was going to go after her.

That was -- it was terrifying. Like the scar, the vision is never going to go away. He can apologize all he wants. That vision is never going to go

away. I might have a scar on my head from when he hit me in the head with my own gun, but the scar -- no.

BANFIELD: I mean, that`s the physical one, right? Your daughter, Ashley, is with us again as I mentioned on the phone. Ashley, can you hear us?

A.LEE (via telephone): Yes, I`m here.

BANFIELD: You know, do you have children of your own, Ashley, by any chance?

A.LEE (via telephone): I do. I have three children. Two boys and a daughter.

BANFIELD: I`m sure you can understand what your mom is going through, right? Knowing what she watched you go through. Did you know, Ashley, at

the time that that gun was pointed at you and that trigger was pulled that that gun was empty? Did you know that?

A.LEE (via telephone)kly. I can`t recall him having his weapon, it just happened so fast. But I know that she was going to do everything in her

will and her power to make sure that I was going to be out of harm`s way. You know, she took a beating for it. And, you know, I`m grateful for her.

And I know she was looking out for us.

BANFIELD: I mean, the miraculous thing about this story is that you really both saved each other. But then you also have to live through this ordeal.

And like you said, it doesn`t go away. Ashley, how do you -- what do you feel when you see the videotape and you see the actual narrative play out

in real time in front of you?

A.LEE (via telephone): You know, when it all happened and after we were able to settle down that night, I couldn`t tell you what had happened and

what was happening in my head and to what I`ve seen on video. It was completely different. It`s not the way it played out in my head as it did

on video.

And so -- very traumatizing. I had no idea when I had that gun behind the counter that he had come around and pulled her gun over the counter and

pulled the trigger.

BANFIELD: Yes. It`s not like it is on the news. Not when you`re having to live it and see it, and you hear the bullets fly and you see what happens.

I want you guys to stay with me if you can because -- obviously Tyrone Lee has been talking and he has been saying how sorry he is, and he`s been

telling us all that, you know, he`s got five kids.

And I think -- I think I want to know how Tina and Ashley feel about that considering the fact he may have five kids, but he did pull that trigger.

Back in a moment.

[18:45:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: When 36-year-old Tyrone Lee stormed into a liquor store in Tulsa last week, he likely expected to leave with a wad of cash. Instead he got a

wad of bandages on his face courtesy of the mother-daughter duo who decided to fight him off.

They were running the store when Lee stopped by. Let`s just say they were more than prepared -- surprising him with a gun of their own and shooting

him six times. Something that did not surprise their brother.

(START VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now the word`s on the street, you come in and mess around, you`re probably going to end up shot dead. We`re not going to be

victims. We grabbed our guns because we`re always packing.

BANFIELD (voice over): The police say Lee drove himself to a nearby hospital in critical condition after the ladies left him behind, running

for their lives as he was bleeding in the store. But lest you feel sorry for Tyrone Lee. You should know that he is now charged with 10 -- 10

different robberies, for this liquor store and nine others in the area as well.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: With me, Sergeant Brandon Watkins of the Tulsa Police Department. Sergeant, nine others in just six weeks. Other than the robberies, is he

likely to face an attempted murder charge because he pulled the trigger, and he`s lucky, I guess, that gun was not loaded any longer.

BRANDON WATKINS, SERGEANT, TULSA POLICE DEPARTMENT (via telephone): Yes. That`s really for the -- the district attorneys and the federal prosecutors

to decide. We`re not really -- we just charged him with the robberies.

[18:50:00] And that`s pretty much the extent of our input on it.

BANFIELD: Can I ask you how many other people in those 10 robberies from January 6th through February 22, how many other people had to face down the

barrel of that sawed off shotgun?

WATKINS (via telephone): Oh, every single one of them. I don`t know the final number. In fact, I think they charged -- parts of the county charged

him with one more today. So, he`s up to 11 now.

BANFIELD: I want to play a little bit of a local interview that a TV station did with Tyrone Lee because everybody wanted to know why did you do

this, and how do you feel about it now. Here`s what he said.

(START VIDEO CLIP)

T. LEE: I was running out of gas. I had no cigarettes. My baby needs pampers. You know what I`m saying? I need food to eat.

I was so scared not just for myself but for them because of what I put them through. I apologize to them, first of all. I apologize to my peers. And I

apologize to myself. I ask God for forgiveness.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Tina Ring is still with me and her daughter Ashley Lee is still on the phone with me. Tina, what`s it like hearing that? What -- how do you

feel about it?

RING: He -- I just -- he`s only sorry because he got caught. You don`t -- 11 robberies? You know, he premeditated. He was in my store the day before

and an hour and 40 minutes before, and then he comes walking down the street with his coat on and a mask and his shotgun. And it -- then he wants

to be sorry? No.

BANFIELD: How about, Ashley, the comment he makes -- believe me, I`ll never do it again. Ashley, do you feel there`s any truth to that now that he has

been caught, now that he knows what he`s facing, do you think he`ll never do it again?

A.LEE (via telephone): No, I honestly can`t say, but I -- you know, I don`t think he`s ever going to change. I mean, he has a history of just criminal

acts, period. I mean, he -- he was well aware of what he was doing. He doesn`t case a place and then come in with a shotgun and then say sorry

about it.

BANFIELD: Yes.

A.LEE (via telephone): I mean, there was 10 other victims, you know. And to show compassion --

BANFIELD: At least, yes.

A.LEE (via telephone): -- to show compassion to show he has a heart. Was he thinking about the victims when he came in and was shoving his sawed off

shotgun in their face? Did it ever occur to him that those folks may have children, family and friends, that want them to come home that night? Was

he thinking that?

BANFIELD: You know, you`re right. You`re right. And you know something else? He may have five kids and may have needed pampers, and that`s very

sad. But he pulled that trigger. He pulled the trigger. And he did not know, Tina, that your gun had unloaded already and that there were no more

bullets left. There is that.

Listen, I wish you the best as you recover from this because people need what it`s like to be a victim. It is not a picnic, and it is no walk in the

park. Ashley, the same you to. Thank you very much for being with us to tell your story. Breathe deeply. You got your girl. You`re making me feel

the same way.

RING: Sorry. I`m sorry.

BANFIELD: Tina, thanks for being with us. Good luck.

RING: Thank you.

BANFIELD: I think when you`re a mom, you feel this.

[18:55:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Next week, we`ll reveal our first CNN hero of 2018. But before we do, it`s always good to look at the winner from 2017, Amy Wright.

(START VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The 2017 CNN Hero of the Year is Amy Wright.

(APPLAUSE)

AMY WRIGHT, 2017 CNN HERO OF THE YEAR: Oh, my gosh. I cannot believe this is happening.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice over): Incredible night, but two months later, Amy has opened a second coffee shop, this one in Charleston, South Carolina.

(CHEERS)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice over): For most of these 17 new employees, this is their first job.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: People with intellectual disabilities aren`t valued, and so this coffee shop has created a place where people see their value.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Go to CNN Heroes and you can watch the full story on Amy, and then you can nominate somebody you think should be a CNN hero this year.

One more thing tonight. That nor`easter did a number up and down the east coast and caused major issues for drivers in New Jersey. Snow and accidents

jammed the highways. In fact, our own executive producer, Liz, ended up sleeping in her car overnight in New Jersey, finally making it home this

morning, 12 hours

[19:00:00] after leaving our office, because of scenes you`re looking at. So tonight we are dedicating "One More Thing" to Liz, and it`s this -- the

best and worst states to drive in. First, the best one, according to wallethub.com, it is Texas. It is followed by Kansas and Nebraska. And the

worst states - Hawaii, where Liz likes to visit. Also Washington and Maryland.

If you are wondering, New Jersey and New York finished ninth and 10th worst respectively. Georgia finished fifth best. And some of our producers, as

you know, work in Atlanta, and they say, I don`t think so. Just personal.

Next hour of CRIME AND JUSTICE starts right now.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She is accused of killing her 5-year-old boy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Him and his girlfriend buried the kid in the backyard.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But that wasn`t what she told police when they came knocking.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All my kids are good.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The day before they found her little boy buried in the dirt.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have a child with special needs?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, Jordan? Yes, I do.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tonight, the body-cam video --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hello, kids --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And the bold-faced lies.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where`s Jordan?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He is with his dad. He is visiting for the holiday.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Police say she could barely stand after crashing her car, let alone pass the sobriety test in her bikini. Now she is taking the

stand.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s really blurry.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: After taking the lives of a Texas woman`s family.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m sorry from the deepest of my heart.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Will her tears today help her stay out of jail?

Taken down by a mom/daughter duo.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are not going to be victims so we grab our guns because we are always packing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Cops say he tried to rob their liquor store with a sawed off shotgun.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You come in here and mess around, you will probably getting end up shot dead.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But they had a gun of their own. And tonight, they have got a story.

Good evening, everyone. I`m Ashleigh Banfield. Welcome to the second hour of CRIME AND JUSTICE.

No one is ever going to tell you kids are easy. And it why most of us have the same reaction when a mom has more than, say, four, you know. It is also

why the city of Cleveland was stopped dead in its tracks by Larissa Rodriguez. She had nine. And she is about to have her 10th in jail.

Because when one of those nine children vanished, Larissa didn`t say boo. She didn`t tell daddy. She didn`t tell police. And when a tipster said that

5-year-old was buried in her back yard, you can only imagine what it was like when the police showed up at her door and started asking questions

about little Jordan and all the other kids living in that home. Only you don`t have to imagine because they taped the whole thing.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

LARRISA RODRIGUEZ, ACCUSED OF KILLING HIS SON, JORDAN: That`s my oldest one.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Brother of a Christopher Rodriguez --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many kids do you have, ma`am?

RODRIGUEZ: I have nine altogether.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But I have some that don`t live with me. But these are the ones that do live with me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have a child with special needs?

RODRIGUEZ: Oh, Jordan? Yes, I do.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How old is Jordan?

RODRIGUEZ: Jordan, he is -- just turned five.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is Jordan at?

RODRIGUEZ: He is with his dad. He is visiting -- going to be visiting for the holiday. He is not here with us right now, for the holiday.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is dad at?

RODRIGUEZ: In Texas. He is not even here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many kids -- you have these children to live with you, right? One, two, three, four, five, six. Six live with you.

RODRIGUEZ: Yes.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: Once the officers got a feel for life that those kids were living in Larissa`s house, they started to zero in on the death that they

suspected happened at Larissa`s house.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Supposedly Jordan is with dad.

RODRIGUEZ: Yes, he is with dad.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Will you call him? Yes?

RODRIGUEZ: Right now, I don`t have the number. He was going to get a new number, but --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s got family?

RODRIGUEZ: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ma`am, I would really love to get in touch with Jordan.

RODRIGUEZ: OK. Is there any way I can give you -- when find the number? To contact you?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who

BANFIELD: I got two.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Any of the kids` disabled?

RODRIGUEZ: He is not really disabled. But that`s the one that`s with his dad.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How old is he?

RODRIGUEZ: He`s just turned five.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where does he live?

RODRIGUEZ: He is staying - he doesn`t live there, but he is just visiting for the holidays.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What -- in Texas?

RODRIGUEZ: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is he usually upstairs?

RODRIGUEZ: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. You got a family member in Texas?

RODRIGUEZ: I`m going to -- that`s why I said is there a number or something where I can contact you guys?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How long has he been in Texas?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can get it now, it`s not a big deal. We will wait.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jordan has -- he has family members in Texas.

RODRIGUEZ: Yes. Yes.

[19:05:01] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. Do you know any numbers or any -- how to get in touch with anybody who actually lives in Texas?

RODRIGUEZ: I mean right now, his phone just got disconnected --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What`s his address?

RODRIGUEZ: I`m waiting for him to call me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What`s his address?

RODRIGUEZ: I don`t know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You just went to send a kid to who knows who, right?

RODRIGUEZ: I mean, no. I mean, I don`t know the address personally because me and his dad don`t really associate like that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But you let him go with him, right?

RODRIGUEZ: Right. He just had his phone disconnected. He is going to be calling me with the phone number. And that`s the only way I can contact

him.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: Justin Freiman, CRIME AND JUSTICE producer, has been following the story all day.

Justin, every time I look at that and I hear her making these excuses like he`s -- he`s in Texas and, I don`t have the number, and I don`t know the

address, and oh, that number was disconnected, all the while it is fascinating in retrospect to know that child is buried in the back yard. So

we just know flat out it is a bald-faced lie that there`s anything remotely connected to Texas in this story. Do we know anything about a dad, though?

Was there a dad in Texas, or is all of that a lie, too?

JUSTIN FREIMAN, CRIME AND JUSTICE PRODUCER: There is a dad in Texas. But the big lie is, as you were saying, that the kid was there. The kid wasn`t

there. And in fact, at one point, they are questioning her about this and how can you not have an address, how do you not have a phone number, and

she says, well, I don`t really like to refer to him as a dad. He is more of a sperm donor.

BANFIELD: Dear God. And the police had the tip all along that a brother of her boyfriend who lived in that home with her, with all those kids, that

boyfriend`s brother, a contractor working over in Pakistan, dials up 911 and says, I got a bad feeling about something. And basically spills the

beans on the fact that this child was dead and buried. Have a listen as he talks about an unresponsive boy. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Basically he told me that something happened with one of the kids. And they didn`t call the cops. And basically he buried him and

his girlfriend buried the kid in the back yard.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Justin, it`s sort of hard to believe that a tip like this, so detailed and so closely connected to this family, it`s her boyfriend`s

brother, came all the way from Pakistan. What if they never had that tip?

FREIMAN: If they had never had that tip, they might haven`t found this body. And you know, when that person was talking to them on the call, they

said when did this happen, when were you told about this? And he says, a while ago. So when they go there to look for the body, they don`t even know

how long this child might have been missing.

BANFIELD: And I`m wondering if the brother didn`t care or didn`t believe it or what might have caused him at that time to finally call authorities and

say something is wrong at the house, maybe go for a welfare visit, which is what we are seeing happen before our eyes.

You can see the branding on the upper right-hand side of your screen, Cleveland police department. This was the welfare check where they heard

Larissa give all sorts of stories about where little 5-year-old Jordan was.

You know, the call that came in from Pakistan, again, he is an American. He was over in Pakistan doing military contract work, was more detailed about

what this couple, Larissa there on the screen and her boyfriend, who is also charged, Christopher Rodriguez, what they were telling all the rest of

the kids about their brother Jordan. Have a listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The story was he -- him and his girlfriend told the older kids that he was staying with her sister who also has a special-needs

kid, and that way they don`t question it. You see what I`m saying? And I was like --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, so they --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They think that they -- they may think he`s with her sister? Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Exactly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: But Justin, that wasn`t the case. The police did not find that body that day. They toured the house. They asked a lot of questions. They

got a lot of lies. When did they find the body?

FREIMAN: They ended up finding that body the very next day buried in that yard.

BANFIELD: So it`s a pretty intriguing thing, especially in retrospect when you look at the tape knowing the whole story, at least all the allegations

in the story. And in fact, there`s a very special moment to zero in on, and that is when Larissa asks a lot of questions of the officers about the tip

they got and what on earth did that tipster say, have a listen to how she put it.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

[19:00:01] RODRIGUEZ: That`s my oldest one.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Brother of a Christopher Rodriguez --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many kids do you have, ma`am?

RODRIGUEZ: I have nine altogether.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But I have some that don`t live with me. But these are the ones that do live with me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have a child with special needs?

RODRIGUEZ: Oh, Jordan? Yes, I do.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How old is Jordan?

RODRIGUEZ: Jordan, he is -- just turned five.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is Jordan at?

RODRIGUEZ: He is with his dad. He is visiting -- going to be visiting for the holiday. He is not here with us right now, for the holiday.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is dad at?

RODRIGUEZ: In Texas. He is not even here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many kids -- you have these children to live with you, right? One, two, three, four, five, six. Six live with you.

RODRIGUEZ: Yes.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: Well, turns out it really wasn`t six, was it? It was really five because the sixth was buried out back. And that wasn`t a place that she

toured the officers.

Justin, unfortunately, that wasn`t the exact moment, but she was very intrigued by the officers` tip. I guess they let on that someone had let

them know something was amiss. What did she ask?

FREIMAN: She actually asked them multiple times, oh, what was the call about? Can you tell me what that`s about? Or is this what it`s pertaining

to? Every time they asked about something, every so often she would throw in, is this what you`re here about? It was very interesting.

BANFIELD: Yes. Let me just find out if we have that sound bite because it`s worth playing if we can find it. It is a short one. It is just a little

thing I picked up, you know. We do have it? Let me play that little moment, Justin, so that our audience can, you know, use their judgment about how

worried she might have been that the jig was up.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We got a call wanting us to check on the wellbeing of the 5-year-old. Where is dad at?

RODRIGUEZ: In Texas. He`s not even here. Is that who you guys are pertaining to?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Maybe possibly.

RODRIGUEZ: What is the call maybe about?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just checking the welfare.

RODRIGUEZ: I mean, I don`t know what this is pertaining to.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: That`s never good.

With me now from Atlanta, Ashley Willcott. She is a certified child welfare law specialist, a trial attorney, and a juvenile court judge. You pretty

much check every single box.

But Ashley, the question here I have was another tiny detail that I saw in these tapes. Larissa uses present tense. She uses present tense when she

refers to baby Jordan even though he is buried in the backyard while she is talking to these officers. Does that make a hoot of difference?

ASHLEY WILLCOTT, CERTIFIED CHILD WELFARE LAW SPECIALIST: Absolutely. Because think about this. Not only is she somebody who is allegedly

murdered her child, she is very evasive and good at making it sound like, oh, yes, everything`s fine. He is with the father.

But the police did a really great job on picking up on this. She could not give details about where the father was, what the phone number was, where

the child was. No parent would ever send their 5-year-old with someone even if it was a father and say, I don`t know the address. I don`t know the

phone number, but it`s OK that child`s there.

BANFIELD: Real quickly, I want to bring in from Atlanta, defense attorney Eric Johnson.

Eric, this is a tough one. But if you are the defense attorney for Larissa, what would you grab at? And I`m grabbing at proverbial straws here. But is

there some defense for her given the tape?

ERIC JOHNSON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, yes. There`s a great defense that she has because of the fact that there is no clear fact of how the child died.

It is possible that the child could have died under accidental circumstances and out of her fear and not knowing what to do in the

situation. She buried the child.

There now would be an issue of her concealing the death of another rather than a murder. We are not saying her actions and in speaking to the police

officers shows that she was trying to conceal something, but the question is, is there going to be enough proof to show that it was a murder?

BANFIELD: Fascinating case. And Cleveland is spellbound by it.

Thank you both, Ashley and Eric. And my thanks to Justin Freiman, as well.

Quite a different look in court today for 21-year-old drunk driving suspect. She was no longer wearing that pretty bikini that she was during

her field sobriety test moments after hitting and killing a father and his unborn son. Instead, Shanna Elliott was buttoned up and even sincere as she

took the witness stand begging that jury to keep her out of prison.

By the way, you can also listen to our show any time. Download our podcast on apple podcasts, Iheartradio, Stitcher, or whatever you get your podcasts

for your CRIME AND JUSTICE fix.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:19:20] BANFIELD: If you live near a river, it is a summer tradition. Grab a tube, fill up a cooler, and go for a float. Unfortunately in San

Marcos, Texas, the neighbors say it`s also a tradition for people to get in their cars and drive home after all that fun after they spent a whole day

drinking on the river.

And one of those people clad only in a bikini was 21-year-old Shana Elliott who had drifted into oncoming traffic and then crashed headfirst into

another car. Police say she was so drunk, she was more than twice the legal limit, and that she couldn`t even stand during her field sobriety test. And

she told the cops that she had only had a few beers and that not aware that she had taken two lives.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[19:20:06] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you remember much about the accident?

SHANA ELLIOT, DEFENDANT: No. It`s really blurry. I just remember as soon as the accident -- as soon as the accident happened, I knew that I had made

the worst decision ever. I remember getting out of my car and going to the other car and making sure they were OK.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But they weren`t, were they?

ELLIOT: No.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: No, they weren`t. In the car that Shana hit was a young, married couple. High school sweethearts, in fact, newlyweds. Fabian and Kristian

Guerrero. Beautiful, beautiful wedding pictures. Fabian was killed. And his wife Kristian on the left, she was hurt, and Kristian was pregnant. But she

wasn`t pregnant the next day. She lost that baby the day after she lost that husband.

And while sorry goes a long way to repair damage, it may not go nearly far enough in the Texas courtroom where Shana is now throwing herself at the

mercy of the jury. Because just steps away from her on the stand is the woman who lost absolutely everything in her life. Steps away from the widow

sniffling in that courtroom. So you can imagine that emotions were running pretty high to say the very least.

With me now is Jeffrey Boney. He is an associate editor for "the Houston Forward Times."

Jeffrey, we hear about drinking and driving all the time, sadly. We hear about cases. They are almost a dime a dozen which is also tragic. But this

case, this case really stands out. There is something to it that is just so wrong and just so sad.

What is the demeanor of this defendant as she faces anywhere from nothing, probation, to 50 years, which is effectively an eternity for her?

JEFFREY BONEY, ASSOCIATED EDITOR, HOUSTON FORWARD TIMES (on the phone): Well, Ashleigh, Shana Elliott, she took the stand on her own behalf, and

she seemed to be remorseful about what occurred. Even the defense attorneys were emphasizing the fact that she was remorseful after the accident

happened.

So in an effort to persuade the jurors, she, you know, basically was trying to go for a relatively lenient sentence for causing this drunken automobile

crash that killed, of course Fabian and their unborn son.

You know, the difference between this situations, I guess, and any other things is she previously pled guilty to these incidents. She knew exactly

what she had done. And she had previous run-ins with the law. She is no stranger to the law. She was accused of possessing heroin, methamphetamine,

and marijuana back in March of 2016. And she was arrested again for possession of heroin two months later in May of 2016. So in this particular

situation, she was trying to throw herself at the mercy of the court. But she tended to not be remorseful but other actions that she had done prior

to this accident.

BANFIELD: Well, to that end, you know, for anybody who tries to throw themselves at the mercy of a jury, it is not an easy thing to do. And if

you are pretending and, you know, shedding crocodile tears, a lot of times they are smart enough to see right through that, or at least they can feel

something is up. So you be the judge when you hear Shana Elliott as she effectively says to the jury, what I did was wrong, and God help me, maybe

you could have some mercy, have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ELLIOT: Just want to say that -- I want to say to the victims` family that I`m sorry from the deepest of my heart. And I know that an apology doesn`t

do much. But I pray for forgiveness every day. And to the jury, I just hope that you can find it in your hearts, whatever`s fair for you all, whatever

your punishment I`m accepting because I accept responsibility. And I know what I did was wrong.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Jeffrey, you cannot help but feel sorry for people, generally people. But this young woman, it is not her first time at the rodeo. She

had admitted to drinking and driving before. Also, she had been arrested three months prior, and then I think five months prior for possession of

heroin and methamphetamine and marijuana, and none of that seemed to be a problem. It certainly didn`t mitigate her behavior on the day when Fabian

Guerrero Moreno and his unborn baby who was supposed to be named after him, Fabian, died.

So I guess it really just comes down to how the jurors reacted. And that`s always difficult. We don`t get the camera angle. We are not allowed to

watch them. But it`s a hard case. Look, everybody could put themselves in that position. But for the fact that her blood alcohol level was .199, and

that`s nearly double the legal limit which if you are trying to figure out how you would act if you were .199, and would you make the same mistake, it

is -- it is described as being in a condition where your behavior is sloppy, you would feel dazed and confused, disoriented. You might need help

to stand or walk. Maybe that`s why Shana can`t keep her balance when she`s doing her bikini test, field sobriety test. The gag reflex is impaired. You

will feel like you are going to vomit, blackouts are likely at this level, at .199. Doesn`t matter how big you are or how small you are, everybody at

.199 would get this kind of an effect. Is that being discussed in this trial so that jurors know damn well how drunk she was?

[19:26:17] BONEY: You know, that`s being -- that has been brought up. But Ashleigh, I think one of the biggest things that the prosecutors brought

out in the sentencing phase here, they played recordings of phone calls that Shana made from jail. And in one of the recordings, you hear her

talking with her boyfriend, speculating that the victims of the crash were part of the cartel. And in another recording, you hear Shana joking and

laughing with her friends about getting her eyebrows threaded in jail just four days after the crash.

So I think they brought that information out to really kind of show that at the remorse argument that she was trying to present or at least the

narrative, she was trying to present, it was not how she was really feeling even after being arrested and being in jail for a few days. And that she

really was aware of what she was doing, and this was a part of her overall lifestyle.

BANFIELD: Wow. Are you kidding -- holy moly, they played those? Jeffrey, they played those audio recordings of her jailhouse conversations where

she`s suggesting that the -- Fabian Guerrero Moreno and his unborn baby and his wife who is a widow, who is in that courtroom, were somehow part of a

cartel? They heard those things?

BONEY: Yes, to hear the recording. And then, of course, again, hearing her laughing and joking and being jovial with her friends about getting her

eyebrows threaded while she was in jail. I mean, these are the type of things where, you know, the prosecutors, I believe, did a pretty good job

of trying to at least in their -- in their argument to try to show her as a non-remorseful individual who really was aware of what had happened and

that this was a part of her everyday lifestyle.

BANFIELD: Wow. That is -- that`s brutal. That is brutal because it is really convenient to feel the way she feels on the stand. You know, when

your judgment and those 12 faces are in front of you. But she had no idea probably when she was on that prison call or that jail call that those 12

faces were going to hear her demeanor while she was awaiting the trial which brings me to Eric Johnson.

Eric, that`s basically in legal speak, that sucks. It sucks.

JOHNSON: Very much so. Very much so. Yes, it does. Yes, it does.

BANFIELD: Yes. So how much does it suck because she is facing zero probation effectively all the way up to 50 years. And jurors, they are no

dummies. They are her peers, right.

JOHNSON: Correct.

BANFIELD: They are going to be able to make the difference between her jailhouse call and then her performance on the stand.

JOHNSON: I think one of the biggest issues from what I`ve seen about the case is the fact that they had a trial in and of itself. I think that her

guilt in this matter was pretty straightforward. So this is something that she may have wanted to take a plea. And the fact that she has gone through

a trial in which the victim has had to sit there and listen through all of these things may something that be taken and held against her when it comes

down for final sentencing.

BANFIELD: Bow, oh boy, oh boy, oh boy. Oh, boy. Can I put one more thing before we wrap this up? I want to her from her one more time. Because

again, I said this wasn`t her first rodeo. I already told you about the drugs. I already told you about the arrests. But then on the stand under

cross-examination, she had to admit, yes, she has been drinking and driving a lot in the past. Have a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Miss Elliott, you are a good student, right?

ELLIOT: Yes, sir.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Pretty smart individual?

ELLIOT: Yes, sir.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So you were fully aware of the risks of your actions on August 2nd, 2016?

ELLIOT: To an extent.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, you are saying the risks didn`t seem real to you, is that what you are saying?

ELLIOT: It seemed real, it did.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you disregarded that risk?

ELLIOT: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Was this your first time being intoxicated and making the decision to drive?

SHANA ELLIOT, DEFENDANT: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many times previously had you done that?

ELLIOT: Quite a few, sadly. It`s too common, and that`s what needs to change.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And is it fair to say that each time before August 2nd, 2016, you were running the risk of this exact result?

ELLIOT: Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, HLN HOST: Yes. It`s too common, it needs to change. And usually the way it changes is when T.V. people like me broadcast cases like

yours, and you end up in the pokey for a long, long time. And then, other people don`t want to end up in the pokey, so they don`t do it. That`s

usually how it works. My thanks to Jeffrey (INAUDIBLE) and Eric Johnson for that.

Have you ever wondered what it`s like for victims of crimes after the crime? A serial armed robbery suspect holds a gun to a young woman`s head

as mom is looking on. He tries to hold up a store but he didn`t know that those two women, mom and daughter, they`re going to fight back. They`re

going to fight back hard. But the bullets fly, and a lot of them fly. And the terror they endured, we`re going to ask that mother what it was like to

have to watch the scene play out in front of her where a man held a gun to her daughter`s head and actually pulled the trigger. That`s next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:36:21] BANFIELD: Have you ever met anyone who`s had a near-death experience? Now, entire T.V. shows are based on it. Some people say they

see a bright light. Other, people say their whole lives flash before their eyes. But I think most people just say it is really freaking scary. And it

was probably really, really scary for Tina Ring when a suspected robber pointed a gun at her daughter`s head.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TINA RING, FOUGHT OFF ARMED ROBBERY SUSPECT: I saw him reach over the counter and pull the trigger.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: When 36-year-old Tyrone Lee first came into their family liquor store masked and holding a sawed-off shotgun, the mother and daughter duo

stood back and they let him empty the cash register. But as he tried to leave through the first door, they locked the second door, and that should

have trapped him had the first door shut more quickly, but it didn`t. So, he came blazing back into the store where mom and daughter now unloaded

their guns. Somehow, though, he wrestled mom to the ground and took her gun and then hunted down her daughter, taking aim and firing. But in a stroke

of sheer luck, that gun that he just wrestled away was empty, and that daughter was spared, and free to run to safety, run out of the store with

her mother. The robbery suspect for his part collapsed behind the cash register.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ASHLEY LEE, FOUGHT OFF ARMED ROBBERY SUSPECT: When I see him hit her in the head and her face just go white and her eyes -- she had her eyes on me the

entire time and it was like, I wanted to help her. And so, I didn`t want to shoot her, and I didn`t want to shoot him, but hell, he hurt my mom. So, I

mean -- in her defense, I did what I had to.

RING: Yes, I know she saved me. And this is my hero.

LEE: You`re my hero.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So, this is Tyrone Lee. He`s got a brand new mugshot to add to his resume, although, in this one, it`s little hard to recognize him

because the ladies managed to get off six rounds into him. He reportedly drove himself to the hospital before being charged with robbery. And it is

not the first time that he has been to this rodeo either. He`s charged in connection with nine other robberies in the neighborhood, and what is his

excuse?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TYRONE LEE, SUSPECT: I ran out of gas. I had no cigarettes. My baby needed pampers. You know what I`m saying? Need food to eat.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So, does any of that mean anything to those ladies who lived through that ordeal? Well, joining me right now is Tina Ring, better known

as mom in this story. And on the phone with us, as well, is Ashley Lee, her daughter. They`re the ones who fought back, and I would say Tina won,

although it`s really hard to say that this -- that there`s anything heroic or positive about this because you are -- you are living with this now. And

I could tell some -- that interview that you did that this is hard.

RING: It is hard. It`s very hard.

BANFIELD: Tell me a little bit about how you and your daughter, Ashley, are getting through, you know, post incident and dealing -- I mean, the news is

over, and usually people move on, and then, you`re just left to cope. How are you guys getting through this?

RING: We just take a breath -- and I`m thankful that she`s alive and she`s there for her children. I`m thankful that I`m alive. I get to be there for

my children and my grandchildren. You just -- I don`t know. I mean --

[19:40:00] BANFIELD: It`s hard to walk in your shoes. It`s hard to even know how to walk in your shoes. I do have this one burning question for you

because in my mind as I watched what happened to you, I thought to myself, God, Tina must have been terrified when she found herself out of bullets.

And then, in an instant later, Tina must have had the most unbelievable relief when she knew the gun was out of bullets because it was now being

pointed at her daughter`s head.

RING: Well, the whole time that I was wrestling with him, I was making sure that I was pulling the trigger and pulling the trigger and pulling the

trigger and just making sure that it was completely empty because I knew that that`s -- I mean, if it had anything left in there, that he was going

to go after her. And that was -- it was terrifying.

BANFIELD: Yes.

RING: I mean, it`s like the scar -- the vision is never going to go away. He can apologize all he wants. That vision is never going to go away. I

might have a scar on my head from when he hit me in the head with my own gun but the scar that -- you know. Not right.

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: I mean, and that`s just the physical one, right? Your daughter, Ashley, is with us, again, as I mentioned on the phone. Ashley, can you

hear us?

A. LEE (via phone): Yes, I`m here.

BANFIELD: You know, do you have children of your own, Ashley, by any chance?

A. LEE: I do. I have three children, two boys and a daughter.

BANFIELD: So, I`m sure you can understand what your mom is going through, right? Knowing what she watched you go through. Did you know, Ashley, at

the time that that gun was pointed at you and that trigger was pulled that that gun was empty? Did you know that?

A. LEE: You know, I wasn`t sure because everything was happening so quickly. You know, and I can`t recall him having his weapon. It just

happened so fast. But I know that she was going to do everything in her will, in her power to make sure that I was going to be out of harm`s way.

And you know, she took a beating for it and you know, I`m grateful for her, and I know she was looking out for us.

BANFIELD: I mean, the miraculous thing about this story is that you really both saved each other, but then, you also have to live through this ordeal.

And then, like you said, it doesn`t go away. Ashley, how do you -- what do you feel when you see this videotape and you see the actual narrative play

out in real time in front of you?

A. LEE: You know, when it all happened and after we were able to settle down that night, I couldn`t tell you what had happened and what was

happening in my head and to what I`ve seen on video. It was completely different. It`s not the way it played out in my head as it did on video.

And so -- very traumatizing, you know, because I have no idea when I had ducked down behind that counter that he had came around and pulled her gun

over the counter and pulled the trigger.

BANFIELD: Yes.

A. LEE: You know.

BANFIELD: It`s not like it is on the news. Not when you`re having to live it and see it, and you hear the bullets fly and you see what happens. I

want you guys to stay with me, if you can, because you know, obviously, Tyrone Lee has been talking, and he`s been saying how sorry he is, and he`s

been telling us all that, you know, he`s got five kids, and I think -- I think I want to know how Tina and Ashley feel about that considering the

fact that he may have five kids, but he did pull that trigger. We`re back in a moment.

[19:45:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: When 36-year-old Tyrone Lee stormed into a liquor store in Tulsa last week, he likely expected to leave with a wad of cash. But instead he

got a wad of bandages on his face, courtesy of the mother-daughter duo who decided to fight him off. They were running the store when Lee stopped by.

And let`s just say they were more than prepared, surprising him with a gun of their own and shooting him six times. Something that did not surprise

their brother.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, the words on the street. You come in here and mess around, you`ll probably going to end up shot dead. We`re not going to be

victims so we grabbed our guns because we`re always packing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: The police say Lee drove himself to a nearby hospital in critical condition after the ladies left him behind running for their lives as he

was bleeding in the store. But lest you feel sorry for Tyrone Lee, you should know that he`s now charged with 10, 10 different robberies, for this

liquor store and nine others in the area as well.

With me Sergeant Brandon Watkins of the Tulsa Police Department. Sergeant, nine others in just six weeks. Other than the robberies, is he likely to

face an attempted murder charge because he pulled the trigger, and he`s lucky, I guess, that gun was not loaded any longer?

SGT. BRANDON WATKINS, TULSA POLICE DEPARTMENT (via telephone): Yes. That`s really for the -- well, the district attorneys and the federal prosecutors

to decide. We`re not really -- we just charged him with the robberies and that`s what -- that`s pretty much the extent of our input on it.

[19:50:00] BANFIELD: Can I ask you how many other people in those 10 robberies from January 6 until February 22? How many other people had to

face down the barrel of that sawed-off shotgun?

WATKINS: Oh, every single one of them. I don`t know the final number. And in fact, I think they charged him -- our counterparts in the county charged

him with one more today. So, he`s up to 11 now.

BANFIELD: I want to play a little bit of a local interview. The T.V. station did with Tyrone Lee because everybody wanted to know why did you do

this and how do you feel about it now? And here`s what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

T. LEE: I was running out of gas. I had no cigarettes. My baby needed pampers, you know what I`m saying? I need food to eat.

I was so scared not just for myself but more for them because of what I put them through.

I apologize to them, first of all, I apologize to my kids and I apologize to myself, you know, and God for forgiveness.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Tina Ring is still with me and her daughter, Ashley Lee, is still on the phone with me. Tina, what`s it like hearing that? What do you -- how

do you feel about it?

RING: He -- I just -- he`s only sorry because he got caught. You don`t -- 11 robberies? You know? He had premeditated. He was in my store the day

before and an hour and 40 minutes before? And then, he comes walking down the street with his coat on and a mask and his shotgun? And then -- and

then, he wants to be sorry? No. No.

BANFIELD: How about, Ashley, the comment he makes, believe me, I`ll never do it again. Ashley, do you -- do you feel there`s any truth to that now

that he has been caught, now that he knows what he`s facing, do you think he`ll never do it again?

A. LEE: No, I honestly can`t say. But, I -- you know, I don`t think he`s ever going to change. I mean, he has a history of just criminal acts,

period. I mean, he was well aware of what he was doing. He doesn`t case a place and then come in with a shotgun and then feel sorry about it. You

know there`s 10 other victims. You know? And to show compassion --

BANFIELD: At least.

A. LEE: To show compassion and to show -- to show he has a heart, was he thinking about the victim when he came in and was shoving his sawed-off

shotgun in their face? You know, did it ever occur to him that those folks may have children, family, and friends that want them to come home that

night? Was he thinking that?

BANFIELD: You know, you`re right. You`re right. And you know something else? He may have five kids and he may have needed pampers and that`s very

sad. But he pulled that trigger. He pulled the trigger. And he did not know, Tina, that your gun had unloaded already and that there were no more

bullets left. So, there is that. Listen, I wish you the best as you recover from this. Because people need to know what it`s like to be a victim. It is

not a picnic and it is no walk in the park. And Ashley, the same to you. Thank you very much for being with us to tell your story. Breathe deeply.

You got your girl. You`re making me tear (INAUDIBLE).

RING: I`m sorry. I`m sorry.

BANFIELD: Tina, thanks for being with us and good luck.

RING: Thank you.

A. LEE: Thank you.

BANFIELD: I think when you`re a mom, you feel this way. Be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:55:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: It`s a great time of year. Next week, we`re going to reveal our first CNN Hero of 2018. But before we do that, let`s give you an update on

last year`s winner, Amy Wright, who opened up a coffee shop that employs people with disabilities.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The 2017 CNN Hero of the Year is Amy Wright.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: Amy Wright.

MAY WRIGHT, 2017 CNN HERO OF THE YEAR: Oh, my gosh, I cannot believe this is happening.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Incredible night, but two months later, Amy has opened a second coffee shop, this one in Charleston, South Carolina. For most of

these 17 new employees, this is their first job.

WRIGHT: People with intellectual disabilities aren`t valued. And so, this coffee shop has created a place where people see their value.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: There you go, Amy. Hey, go to cnn.com, CNN HEROES to watch the full story on Amy. And you can also nominate somebody you think should be a

CNN Hero for this year.

In case you missed it, that nor`easter, it did quite a number up and down the East Coast, just ask any of my friends and colleagues here. It caused a

lot of issues for drivers especially in New Jersey. Snow and accident- jammed highways were sort of the order of the day. People were stuck in traffic for up to 12 hours. So, our executive producer, Liz, is not at work

today because she had to sleep in her car last night in New Jersey. It took her 12 hours to get from this office, where I`m broadcasting, to her home.

About 5:00 this morning, she got there.

So tonight, our "ONE MORE THING" is dedicated to our fearless producer Liz who I hope is napping right now. And, of course, it is the best and worst

states to drive in. That`s "ONE MORE THING" tonight. Yes. First, the best one, according to (INAUDIBLE) .com, it is Texas, followed by Kansas and

Nebraska. Worst states are Hawaii, weird because Liz loves to go there. It`s also Washington and Maryland on the list. And if you`re wondering, New

Jersey and New York, they finished 9th and 10th worst, respectively.

END