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Senate Judiciary Committee Hearing; Senate Committee to take Kavanaugh Vote; Flake Left Hearing with Coons. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired September 28, 2018 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[13:00:00] SEN. RICHARD BLUMENTHAL (D), CONNECTICUT: Investigate their claims and clear their name.

Judge Kavanaugh refused to make that request. Dr. Blasey Ford did so.

The question is, what is he hiding, what is the administration concealing? Why have we not received those millions of pages of documents that remain hidden? Why has Judge Kavanaugh not taken a polygraph? He says they're not reliable and that the polygraph Dr. Ford subjected herself to was meaningless. She passed it. As district -- as a judge on the D.C. Circuit, Judge Kavanaugh ruled that they are, in fact, meaningful. He wrote, quote, law enforcement agencies use polygraphs to test the credibility of witnesses and criminal defendants. Refusing to take a polygraph, Judge Kavanaugh has failed that test.

Judge Kavanaugh claimed that all four witnesses Dr. Blasey Ford identified as being present at the party have said that the sexual assault, quote, didn't happen. Only one person has said the sexual assault didn't happen, Brett Kavanaugh. The other three partygoers Dr. Blasey Ford identified said they do not remember the incident. That is a big difference. Do not recall is a different statement than it didn't happen. And the other woman Dr. Blasey Ford named who was there has since publically states that she believes Dr. Blasey Ford's account.

Judge Kavanaugh tried to give himself an alibi, making it sound like he didn't drink on week nights. His own high school calendar, which he provided the committee as evidence, contradicts that statement. During the hearing, in an exchange with my colleague Senator Booker, Judge Kavanaugh admitted that one of the entries on his calendar from a Thursday signified that he went to a friend's house to drink.

He said repeatedly that he never in his life drank so much that he couldn't remember. Numerous people who spent considerable time with him during the hearing in high school, during his high school, college, and law school years confirmed that he frequently drank to excess and sometimes became belligerent.

Finally, Judge Kavanaugh claimed that he has always treated women with dignity and respect. His words. Yet he and his high school friends named one of my constituents, Renate Dolphin, in their yearbook pages saying they were her alumnus, reducing her to a sexual conquest. That is no way to treat women with dignity and respect. In fact, she attested to the pain that it has caused her.

He would have us believe that these brave, courageous, sexual assault survivors have come forward as part of a vast, right wing conspiracy. How insulting to them to say that they are pawns or puppets of us or anyone else. In fact, they are brave, courageous, independent women who have stepped forward.

And so I want to say in conclusion to the men of America, for you, I hope this will be a teaching moment not to denigrate anyone who has been a survivor of sexual assault, but to lift them up.

I want to enter into the record the stories of a number of constituents of mine whose pain, sadness, shame, self-doubt, guilt, fear are powerfully attested to in these statements, Mr. Chairman.

SEN. CHUCK GRASSLEY (R), CHAIRMAN, JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: Without objection, so ordered.

BLUMENTHAL: They are the heroes here. Dr. Blasey Ford is a profile (ph) in courage (ph). And I want to say to her sons, you should be proud of your mother. You should be proud of your mom. She is a profile in courage and her name will be in the history books long after ours are gone.

[13:05:15] She will be remembered as someone who stepped forward, truly, to speak truth to power. We use that phrase a lot. She did it yesterday. And I am proud to say that I believe Dr. Blasey Ford and I hope that her two sons and her husband are as proud of her as we should be.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

And, with that, I will oppose the nominee and I will step out.

GRASSLEY: We'll stand at ease until the fall of the gavel.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: It's been an extremely explosive, very fiery hearing that the Senate Judiciary Committee has engaged in over these past, at least three hours and more anticipated.

The vote in the committee whether to confirm or reject the confirmation of the Supreme Court Nominee Judge Brett Kavanaugh was scheduled for 1:30, but there are apparently developments happening behind the scenes right now. It looks like there's some serious consultations.

There you see, in the middle of your screen, you see the chairman, Chuck Grassley, Orrin Hatch is there and others, they're discussing -- apparently they're waiting for some members to show up and they're waiting for a decision on who else will speak before the actual roll call in the Judiciary Committee.

Dana Bash is working her sources.

Dana, what are you hearing? DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, first I'll just

report what Manu Raju, who's in the room, saw with his own eyes, which is after Chris Coons, the Democrat of Delaware, gave a very impassioned, heartfelt speech about a lot of things, but mostly about, you know, the need for delay, about the need for comity, for the fact that this -- the Senate committee yesterday was a debacle from every side. And after that happened, the -- I'm sorry, I'm just looking -- as I'm speaking, I'm looking at my --

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: I know.

BASH: I'm looking at my e-mail to see because Manu just sent something -- to see -- so after that speech that Chris Coons gave, he and Jeff Flake, the Republican from Arizona, who announced earlier today that he was going to vote yes, they got up and they walked out and they started to have a discussion. And they haven't come back since.

So they're having discussions to the side. And this -- sort of the back story of the two of them is that they're good friends. And they've traveled the world together. They're on the Foreign Relations Committee, in addition to this committee, together. They're friends across party lines. And we don't know what they're discussing. If perhaps what Senator Coons said about his plea to delay the vote. Senator Klobuchar, her plea to delay the vote, another person whom Jeff Flake has a relationship with across -- across the aisle. We don't know the answer to that, but right now the vote is scheduled for 1:30, but there's still 20 minutes for that to potentially change depending on what is this --

BLITZER: Let's go to Manu Raju. He was in the Senate Judiciary Committee hearing room. Just stepped outside.

Manu, update our viewers on the very latest.

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's right.

What was interesting late in these proceedings was Senator Jeff Flake of Arizona, of course, who said that he would support this nomination earlier, essentially giving the Republicans the vote to advance this nomination, he abruptly got up late in the hearing. He waived to his friend, Chris Coons, the Democrat, who appealed to delay this vote and Coons had raised some significant concerns. Collins and Flake walked into the room, the whole -- the anti-room (ph) outside of the hearing room. They appeared to have some discussion.

Coons came back. He has more discussions with on the Democratic side of the aisle with Senator Dianne Feinstein. They were treated as well.

Now, it's unclear what any of this means because we had expected Flake to deliver remarks at the -- before this 1:30 vote announcing his support for Brett Kavanaugh, but we have known that he's been under enormous pressure. We saw protesters, of course, confronting him earlier today. He has said himself, he was deeply torn about whether or not to support Kavanaugh. So his -- so whether there's a change of heart, we don't know. It's -- but it definitely caught a lot of people by surprise in that hearing room. [13:10:25] It, of course, has been a very unpredictable confirmation

process so far. We'll see if there's another twist. But at the moment, the Republicans still feel they have the votes. At least to get a majority vote on the committee right now. Still an ultimate question on whether those two key Republican swing votes come down, Lisa Murkowski and Susan Collins.

But at the moment, a little bit of drama and questions surrounding Jeff Flake after he made that announcement to support today, but suddenly disappeared before delivering his own remarks before this 1:30 vote, Wolf.

BLITZER: And just to be precise, Manu, they're in recess right now, but they're waiting for the 1:30 scheduled vote. But if Jeff Flake, for example, goes back into that committee hearing room, he could deliver his remarks before the -- before the roll call, right?

RAJU: Yes, he certainly can. And that's -- that was the expectation all along that he would. And several Democrats too were expected to deliver their own opposition remarks to the nomination, but because of how tense this has gone and how much -- how bitterly divided this panel is right now, several of these Democrats walked out of the room in disgust earlier this morning, refused to participate in the proceedings. Kamala Harris, Mazie Hirono two of them. So they -- so that's why there's a little bit of lag time before this set 1:30 vote.

And, of course -- of course we mentioned Jeff Flake. He was expected to speak as well. But nevertheless, this panel bitterly, bitterly divided over this nomination. It's been hugely, of course, contentious. Ultimately the key question, where do those moderate senators come down and does Jeff Flake have a change of heart. We don't have any indication that's the case yet. But, still, curious him not delivering remarks announcing his support after he put out a paper statement earlier today, Wolf.

BLITZER: And after he did announce that he would vote to confirm Judge Kavanaugh, he was outside of the hearing room, going towards an elevator. Let me play the clip of what happened then.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What you are doing is allowing someone who actually violated a woman to sit in the Supreme Court. This is not tolerable. You have children in your family. Think about them. I have two children. I cannot imagine that for the next 50 years they will have to have someone in the Supreme Court who has been accused of violating a young girl. What are you doing, sir?

This is the future --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was sexually assaulted and nobody believes me. I didn't tell anyone and you're telling all women that they don't matter, that they should just stay quiet because if they tell you what happened to them, you're going to ignore them. That's what happened to me, and that's what you're telling all women in America, that they don't matter. They should just keep it to themselves because if they have told the truth they're just going to help that man to power anyway. That's what you're telling all of these women. That's what you're telling me right now.

Look at me when I'm talking to you. You're telling me that my assault doesn't matter. That what happened to me doesn't matter. And that you're going to let people who do these things into power. That's what you're telling me when you vote for him.

Don't look away from me. Look at me and tell me that it doesn't matter what happened to me, that you'll let people like that go into the highest court of the land and tell everyone what they can do to their bodies.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: A very powerful moment indeed.

Manu, so what happened? He was obviously berated very angrily by these two women who were screaming at him. So what happened then?

RAJU: Yes, he came back and he was visibly shaken by that moment and by his decision to support the nomination. He had said for days how difficult this was, how he was torn. That's what he said last night after the hearing.

And when he was in the hearing room, I was watching him very closely. He was looking down. He was frowning a lot. He was just not in a good mood at all and he left a couple of times and then, as I mentioned earlier, left for that extended period after waving to his friend Chris Coons to have a discussion privately about what was perhaps going through his head.

But, undoubtedly, this has had some -- an impact on him. I can tell you, there were protesters all throughout the halls of the Senate office buildings. Oftentimes these Republican senators are getting shouted at as they're walking just from office to office. A level of antipathy that we just have not seen for some time, showing just how difficult a vote this is for some senators who are torn, Republican and Democratic senators, uncertain how they may ultimately vote.

[13:15:15] We'll see if any -- if there's any change for Jeff Flake. Right now we're not getting indication there's any change, but we'll see in just a matter of minutes where the committee will ultimately vote on deciding whether to send his nomination to the full Senate, Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Manu, we're going to stay in very close touch with you. Thank you for your excellent reporting.

We're watching very closely, the Senate Judiciary Committee. They're in a temporary recess right now.

Actually, let's listen in. I think they -- they may be resuming this hearing.

GRASSLEY: At 1:30. If there's some reason to change that, then we'll have to change it. But I'm not even going to get into the discussion about that right now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fair enough.

BLITZER: There you see the chairman, Chuck Grassley, saying this vote will still take place in about 14 minutes or so, 1:30 p.m. Eastern, unless there's a change, and that is clearly still very possible.

I just want to see what -- what's going on right now because this could be a sensitive moment if there is going to be a change. I want to know -- that's Senator John Cornyn of Texas. He's the number two Republican in the U.S. Senate, just whispering something to Chuck Grassley.

Let's see if he -- for a quick second -- if he says anything or if he's going to continue this recess.

The recess. Let's take a quick break. Our special coverage continues right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:21:05] BLITZER: The Senate Judiciary Committee currently in a very, very brief recess. They're awaiting the return of Senator Jeff Flake of Arizona. He announced, as this hearing was getting underway, he would vote in favor of the confirmation of Judge Brett Kavanaugh. But there has been some deliberations outside. He's been meeting with Senator Coons, among others the Democratic senator who's a very close friend of his, clearly upset about Senator Flake's decision.

They're supposed to vote in about nine minutes. There you see on the right part of your screen, Senator Chuck Grassley. He is the chairman of the Judiciary Committee. He says the vote will occur at 1:30 p.m. Eastern.

He's having a little brief conversation there with Dianne Feinstein, the ranking Democrat on the Judiciary Committee.

I quickly want to go to our chief White House correspondent, Jim Acosta, who's getting reaction over there at the White House.

What are you hearing, Jim?

JIM ACOSTA, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, they've been pretty clear about this all morning, that they are not sure over here if they have the votes. Obviously they were breathing a sigh of relief last night after Judge Kavanaugh's performance.

But to have all of this riding on Jeff Flake at the moment, Wolf, I think is very interesting, in part because Jeff Flake and President Trump have been at odds, and that's putting it mildly, with one another for some time now. As you know, Senator Flake has given several speeches. I think he has one coming up next week up in New Hampshire where he has really gone after the president and the president has gone after Jeff Flake on Twitter and so on. It sort of reminds you of, Wolf, when the president was sparring with John McCain and then John McCain, at that very dramatic moment, gave a thumbs down to Republican efforts to repeal Obamacare.

And so a lot riding on what Jeff Flake does right now. He's already announced, from what we understand, that he's going to be supporting Judge Kavanaugh. But it is, I think, very interesting that he's out of the room.

I will tell you, Wolf, that one of the deputy press secretaries over here, Raj Shah, was pretty straightforward with CNN earlier this morning when he said that they aren't really sure how this is going to go. They're confident they think it's going to happen, but they know it's going to be close. Here's what he had to say.

And, Wolf, I --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RAJ SHAH, WHITE HOUSE DEPUTY PRESS SECRETARY: The White House is pretty engaged with a number of senators in both parties, I think you guys can figure out who they are, in trying to secure their votes.

QUESTION: Does he have the votes right now, Raj?

QUESTION: Is President Bush also helping in that effort? There's been a report that he has been calling some of the folks who are considered insiders (ph)?

SHAH: I would refer questions to President Bush's office.

QUESTION: Is he going to talk on the phone with Judge Kavanaugh today?

SHAH: Is the president?

QUESTION: Yes.

SHAH: I'm not sure.

See you guys.

QUESTION: Has the president spoken to McConnell?

SHAH: See you guys.

He talked to him yesterday.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Now, Wolf, another interesting thing we should note with Joe Manchin, the Democrat from West Virginia, who's up for re-election this fall, he is one of those senator sitting on the fence at this point. He's had a better relationship with President Trump. And so it might be also interesting to see if Joe Manchin is the person who bails out this nomination for the Republicans while he's facing this very tough re-election in West Virginia.

Wolf, I will let you know that President Trump is expected to be available for questions in about an hour or so from now, maybe less than an hour, when he meets with the president of Chile in the Oval Office. That's been opened up to cameras and to reporters. And so we may get a chance to ask the president about all of this.

As you know, he tweeted last night that he's ready to see a vote on all of this. So did the vice president. But we haven't really had a chance to ask the president any questions in terms of how he feels this testimony went yesterday in terms of how Dr. Ford, you know, handled herself in front of that committee. There are a lot of people on both sides, Republican and Democrat, who feel very badly about what happened to Christine Blasey Ford.

We have not heard from the president. As he said at that news conference earlier this week, Wolf, he said that, well, there's a chance he could change his mind when it comes to Christine Blasey Ford. He seemed to put that to rest last night when he said he was -- he thought that Judge Kavanaugh had handled himself well.

[13:25:04] We know there were almost cheering over here at the White House at the Supreme Court nominee's bombastic performance there at the Senate Judiciary Committee. And so, at this point, Wolf, I think one of the very interesting things to watch, obviously, is how Jeff Flake is going to respond to all of this, what he's going to say in the next several moments because he's been sort of on the fence on all of this and he had that very dramatic encounter in the elevators earlier this morning over in the Senate. But also exactly what the president has to say about this. He may -- they may decide over here, Wolf, to keep the president, you know, restrained. He may decide to keep himself restrain and not say anything because it is such a delicate moment right now for this process, Wolf.

BLITZER: The roll call, Jim, is about to begin in the Senate Judiciary Committee. You see on the left of your screen, the chairman, Chuck Grassley, he's waiting.

Let's take a very quick break. Our special coverage continues right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Very sensitive moment developing right now at the Senate Judiciary Committee. The chairman, Chuck Grassley, he's going to have a roll call among the 21 members, 11 Republicans and 10 Democrats, who will decide, at least on the committee basis, the fate of the Supreme Court justice, Brett Kavanaugh. We'll have live coverage of that coming up.

This -- you know, as we watch this, Gloria, this is an extremely sensitive moment because we were anticipating that Jeff Flake, who was on the fence earlier, but announced just a couple hours ago he would vote in favor of confirming Brett Kavanaugh to the United States Supreme Court. He was expected to speak. We were expecting to hear him before the roll call. He walked out. He met with a good friend of his, Senator Chris Coons. But apparently he hasn't come back into that room yet. We may still hear from him I assume before the vote.

BORGER: Yes. And I'm going to defer to my colleague, Dana Bash now, because she's just done some reporting on this. And then I'll -- then I'll talk.

BLITZER: OK.

BASH: Well, I just -- I just -- my understanding is that the discussions are still going on. Are --

BLITZER: The discussions?

BASH: The discussions -- OK, so there are discussions going on as we speak with Jeff Flake and -- the Republican, who, again, had said that he would vote yes, but then got up after Chris Coons, a Democrat, spoke, and they haven't come out since. The discussions between the two of them, and it seems more than them, but at least those are the core two negotiators, if you will, are ongoing and active. I -- that's what I am told, but I don't know anything more than that.

The fact that there are active discussions going on and it's literally 30 seconds now until the time that this vote is supposed to take place is obviously -- it tells you how much drama there is right now. Unclear if they are going to get to whatever point these discussions are heading. Will they -- will they get to a delay in the vote? Will they get to something even more dramatic when it comes to how Jeff Flake had initially said he was going to vote? We don't know the answer to that because it is literally happening behind the scenes, behind that (INAUDIBLE), as we speak.

[13:30:06] BORGER: And I think delay would be the sort of most likely way they could get -- they could put some pressure on Flake.